Stud8 - Day 5, Hand 8

Aaron W. · #1 12-06-2005, 02:56 PM

This was by far the most interesting hand of the day for me.

I bet 4th hoping to lose the 85, but when it failed, I saw no value in betting 5th.

On 6th, I really didn't have a plan, so I checked. When the open jacks checked and the 9 + 3-lows bet, I figured that I probably have high (open jacks would have bet two pair, right?), and so I check-raised to protect my half of the pot from the jacks. Am I getting a little out of line?

7 Card Stud High-Low ($0.25/$0.50), Ante $0.05, Bring-In $0.10 (converter)

3rd Street - (1.20 SB)

Seat 2: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 3: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___brings-in
Seat 5: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 7: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 8: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls

4th Street - (3.20 SB)

Seat 2: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___bets
Seat 5: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Seat 7: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Seat 8: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks___folds

5th Street - (3.60 BB)

Seat 2: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks
Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks
Seat 5: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks
Seat 7: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___checks

6th Street - (3.60 BB)

Seat 2: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets___raises
Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___checks___raises___calls
Seat 5: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks___folds
Seat 7: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks___calls___calls

River - (12.60 BB)

Seat 2: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] xx___bets
Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Seat 7: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] xx___checks___calls

Total pot: (15.60 BB)

mscags · #2 12-06-2005, 03:09 PM

I don't think you have enough value to bet fourth. I like trying to represent a better low when you have at least some low draw, but in this case you don't have much of anything going for you, plus you are in last position, take the free card happily. I would bet sixth and hope it clears the field some. Your plan is alright, but I don't see much merit in it because the pot is so small.

Alchemist · #3 12-06-2005, 03:33 PM

I kind of like the bet on 4th. It's somewhat table dependent. If they don't fold when you represent 4 to a low, then don't do it here. 85 might have 4 lows but may have checked in fear of you.

5th I check and fold to any bet.

I really dislike the C/R on 6th. You're in an awkward spot with a raggedy hand and three opponents. You could argue that you're trying to get rid of the two hangers-on behind you, but you really don't know where you stand with Seat 2 whose play has been peculiar thus far. At this point I put him on trip 9s or two small hearts who intended to C/R 5th but you didn't cooperate by checking yourself.

I'd say he's got a made low on 6th and you still have a pair of Queens. I think you have to let it go here.

Kurn, son of Mogh · #4 12-06-2005, 03:48 PM

I hate the bet on 4th and the raise on 6th. The pot is small and there are too many players around for you to get them all to fold.

On 4th, you have nothing and are drawing 2 cards to a low.

On 6th, you're raising a pair of Queens into a live Ace.

On the river you can call for pot odds.

Alchemist · #5 12-06-2005, 04:34 PM

On second thought, the bet on 4th isn't a good idea. It could be effective if you're going against low hands only, but you've got two folks high coming along. This hand is check/fold territory from start to finish.

Spladle Master · #6 12-06-2005, 05:00 PM

Check fourth, bet or check/call sixth because check-raising is suicidally dumb, fold river.

Kurn, son of Mogh · #7 12-06-2005, 05:31 PM

I can't fold the river getting 6.8:1. I mean, I know I'm beat when the open jacks call, but not before then.

Spladle Master · #8 12-06-2005, 05:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I can't fold the river getting 6.8:1.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yes you can.
[ QUOTE ]
I mean, I know I'm beat when the open jacks call, but not before then.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yes you do.

Aaron W. · #9 12-07-2005, 03:50 AM

Wow... I didn't know that this hand was so terrible. I really thought the bet on 4th was smart. I'll add it to the "NEVER DO THIS AGAIN" file. (Just to be clear... Betting 4th would be better if I were against just the low hand. With the high hands coming along, I don't gain enough by getting rid of the low hand to justify betting 4th.)

Horray for being galactically stupid and still winning half the pot. Seat 2's 86 low got outdrawn by seat 7's rivered 3 to make an 85 low. I take high because Seat 7 missed his club draw and his two pair cards and seat 2 didn't hit a gutshot.

Seat 2: 6h 3d 9h 8h 4d 2s 6s
Hero: Ts 2h 4h 6d Qd Qc 7d
Seat 7: 2c 4c 8c 5d Jc Jd 3s

Spladle Master · #10 12-07-2005, 04:02 AM

Fourth Street:

pokenum -mc 500000 -7s8 6h 3d 9h 8h - ts 2h 4h 6d - 2c 4c 8c 5d / qs js 5h 5c 9s
7-card Stud Hi/Low 8-or-better: 500000 sampled outcomes
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3d 9h 8h 6h 32232 192120 307811 69 38818 89670 176 0.254
Ts 6d 4h 2h 30024 116805 383054 141 105267 41339 955 0.237
8c 4c 2c 5d 132464 190919 308979 102 297462 83992 791 0.509

Sixth Street:

pokenum -7s8 6h 3d 9h 8h 4d 2s - ts 2h 4h 6d qd qc - 2c 4c 8c 5d jc jd / qs js 5h 5c 9s ah qh
7-card Stud Hi/Low 8-or-better: 17550 enumerated outcomes
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
2s 4d 3d 9h 8h 6h 475 475 17075 0 14775 2775 0 0.434
Ts Qc Qd 6d 4h 2h 0 9549 8001 0 0 0 0 0.272
Jc 8c 4c 2c Jd 5d 925 7526 10024 0 2775 5025 0 0.293