Tricky KJs hand

[PocketPaul]

Bodog $2-$4 table. Table is generally loose but I have no real reads on villain except tht he was not noticeably loose or aggressive.

Hero is in cut off with K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Preflop - I just call (Thinking about it now I think I should have raised) When should KJs raise preflop in the cut off? Always, or only if 1st in, or if there are a lot of limpers?

Flop - I have a gutshot draw (4 outs)a backdoor flush draw (1 1/2 outs) and an overcard (1 1/2 outs) so approx 7 outs. I decided to raise the flop,partly to give me a chance of taking a free card on the turn and partly to clean up some of my K outs

Turn - Good I hit my overcard, but is my turn raise too aggressive given that villain 3 bet the flop and led the turn? I figured his most likely hand was a Q, hence the raise.

River - A value bet seemed OK here despite the risk that villain held a T.

I am unsure about several of the plays on this hand and welcome alll constructive criticism.

Preflop - 4 limpers Hero calls, button folds, SB completes BB checks

Flop 6 players (6SB) Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

3 checks, Villain Bets, 1 call, Hero raises, 3 folds, Villain 3 bets, 1 fold, Hero calls

Turn 2 players(6BB) K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Villain bets, hero raises, villain calls

River 2 players (10BB) J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Villain checks, hero bets, villain calls

Result - to follow

PREFLOP: Yes you should raise it here, your hand is too strong not to, you have an equity edge and you must push it by raising. As far as when you should raise KJs in the CO, if you raised in the CO every time without thinking no matter how many limpers there are, this would be pretty close to optimal play.

FLOP: If you had raised preflop, Then I like your flop play. Since the pot will be bigger, the reward of getting a free card on the turn is worth the risk of getting 3 bet. Given that you didnt raise preflop, I dont like your flop raise, with a smaller pot, I would just call. The risk reward ratio is now not worth it IMO. However if you had a read that the flop bettor was passive then once again I would raise this flop.

TURN: Since you have likely taken the lead over the villains hand and you still have outs in case youre trailing, I Like your turn raise here. This is good aggressive poker IMO.

RIVER: The only hand that beats you is QT, which the villain probably wouldve bet the river. Since the villain checked, I think betting here looks right. Nice value bet.

[crunchy1]

I raise this PF.

I don't like your flop raise regardless of whether or not you had raised PF. The only hand you're really interested in folding out at this point is AK (or KJ). You're draw is weak. However, if you only call, you allow the 3 players between you and Villian to trail along. There's a good chance for them to make a second best hand on the turn or the river which they may lead out - allowing you to trap the field from late position.

[SNOWBALL138]

[ QUOTE ]
I raise this PF.

I don't like your flop raise regardless of whether or not you had raised PF. The only hand you're really interested in folding out at this point is AK (or KJ). You're draw is weak. However, if you only call, you allow the 3 players between you and Villian to trail along. There's a good chance for them to make a second best hand on the turn or the river which they may lead out - allowing you to trap the field from late position.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree

I liked the way you played the hand minus the preflop play. I think you raise this preflop regardless of the number of players if you are in the CO. You have great position to act post-flop, and you have a good hand that will win more than it's share. Otherwise, nh. What did villian show down?

[gopnik]

it's not really tricky.
Just raise preflop, call the flop and bet the turn and river.

[PocketPaul]

Villain showed down a pair of 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] to take the pot with a set of 2's. I guess I was lucky he did not 3 bet the turn or raise the river.

Thanks for the comments. I definitely should have raised pre flop, but I am not convinced that raising the flop is an error.

[ QUOTE ]
Villain showed down a pair of 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] to take the pot with a set of 2's. I guess I was lucky he did not 3 bet the turn or raise the river.

Thanks for the comments. I definitely should have raised pre flop, but I am not convinced that raising the flop is an error.

[/ QUOTE ]
Raising this flop with your gutshot/backdoor flush/overcard draw is not inherently bad or good. It really depends on the situation. In a small pot with no read on my opponents I will usually just call on the flop if I have the odds to continue and im not worried about a raise coming from behind me. In a large pot, I am much more inclined to raise this flop with no read, since getting a chance to see a free river is so valuable in a large pot that I believe it more than offsets the chances of a 3 bet or of someone betting the turn instead of checking to me.
In general, the more aggressive your opponents are the stronger your draws need to be to make this play(premium draws like flush draws and OESD) but the more passive your opponents are the more weaker your draw can be to pull off the free card play( hands like gutshots, middle pair/bottom pair, and just overcard draws)