Check-calling for value

Agthorr · #1 12-11-2005, 02:48 AM

I find that my bets and raises are getting too much respect, so that I'm not getting paid off. When I've shown strength and my opponents are acting very weak, I'm starting to think I'd be better off check-calling and pretending like I've missed my hand or I'm afraid of the card that just came, so that they come with me all the way to the river (where I might bet or check-raise). What do you think?

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, MP3 calls, 4 folds.

Flop: (5.50 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, MP3 calls.

Turn: (3.75 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, MP3 folds.

Final Pot: 4.75 BB

MP3 has a VPIP of 56%, PFR of 7%, WTSD of 31%, and an aggression factor of 1.36 (after 366 hands). On the flop, I have an overpair and an OESD. Since it's heads-up, I'm not too worried about my opponent happening to have two clubs. Since I have two Jacks, he's much less likely to have any, and I don't think he's likely to have called with 76 or 65. Also, he probably doesn't have something like AK or a higher pair, as he probably would have raised those pre-flop. If he's got a Q, making a higher pair doesn't actually help him because it gives me a straight. Basically, I figure he's got 3 to 6 outs against me, likely to fold if I bet, but likely to bet if I check. Do you agree?

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls, 4 folds, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (3 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, BB calls, MP1 calls.

Turn: (3 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, BB folds, MP1 folds.

Final Pot: 4 BB

BB is very loose-passive. MP1 is a more decent player, but still on the loose-passive side.

On the turn, what's my best line for extracting value from these guys?

Vote4Pedro · #2 12-11-2005, 02:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
what's my best line for extracting value from these guys?

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet, bet, more bet

Jaran · #3 12-11-2005, 02:59 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
what's my best line for extracting value from these guys?

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet, bet, more bet

[/ QUOTE ]

Also, you could try betting. As a wise man once said, "People like to call. I like to let them."

-Jaran

McGahee · #4 12-11-2005, 03:04 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
what's my best line for extracting value from these guys?

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet, bet, more bet

[/ QUOTE ]

Please tell me that avatar's a joke.

Vote4Pedro · #5 12-11-2005, 03:24 AM

I hate Duke with a passion, but god damnit do I respect JJ

Sean D · #6 12-11-2005, 04:05 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I hate Duke with a passion, but god damnit do I hate JJ even more

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP.

jaxUp · #7 12-11-2005, 04:34 AM

there is a spot to c/c for value, and it is not here.

Agthorr · #8 12-11-2005, 04:53 AM

[ QUOTE ]
there is a spot to c/c for value, and it is not here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay, fair enough. What the reasons that it's not here and what are the guidelines to know when is the right place?

I lot of people have responded with advice in form of blanket statements, but that's not really useful for helping me to understand or improve my game. :-(

bottomset · #9 12-11-2005, 05:04 AM

[ QUOTE ]
People like to call. I like to let them

[/ QUOTE ]

this is an old favorite of mine, and soo true and important to succeeding at these levels(or any level for that matter) you win money by making bets/raises and getting called by weaker hands

DRD66 · #10 12-11-2005, 06:25 AM

**grunch**
Bet. Always.
Start counting the times you see calls with junk hands - it's more than you see folds