Will Rove Resign?

[trippin bily]

Of course he should not resign.Is what he said not the truth? Of course it is.
The amusing thing about this is the number of Dems having hissy fits over Roves statements but were mute over Durbins.
Rove mentioned LIBERALS not Democrats. Why are the Dems in an uproar. Rove was talking about Moveon.org. They have nothong to do with the Democrats. Right?

[BCPVP]

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That's why I'm glad Howard Dean is the new chair of the Democratic Party

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I'm glad too, but for slightly different reasons. Keep him talking, Whiskey!

[Greg J]

I support socialized medicine. I support higher taxes, especially if you make more money. I support civil liberties, and the freedom to express unpopular, or even blatently wrong positions. I support gay rights. I think government is not necessarily bad, but can be a force for good to improve people's lives. I think the war on poverty was a just cause, and should not have been abandoned.

1) Does this make me a "liberal" to you?

2) Okay, if you say yes, then please explain how does this make me wimpy with regards to kicking the living hell out of any psychopath that wants to fly planes into building, murdering innocent men women and children.

Seriously dude. This is an issue I think we can agree on.

[[censored]]

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I support socialized medicine. I support higher taxes, especially if you make more money. I support civil liberties, and the freedom to express unpopular, or even blatently wrong positions. I support gay rights. I think government is not necessarily bad, but can be a force for good to improve people's lives. I think the war on poverty was a just cause, and should not have been abandoned.

1) Does this make me a "liberal" to you?

2) Okay, if you say yes, then please explain how does this make me wimpy with regards to kicking the living hell out of any psychopath that wants to fly planes into building, murdering innocent men women and children.

Seriously dude. This is an issue I think we can agree on.

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Yes it does for the most part make you liberal, it does NOT make you wimpy.

I remember being on campus following 9/11 and during the run up to Afganastan. There were a significant number of self proclaimed liberal or progressive students who protested and wrote in the school paper their oppossition to the use of force against the Taliban. They felt that America was no better than the terrorist and that this action would result only in creating new terrorist. They argued that instead we should seek to discussion and a UN solution. Would you deny that these factions do exist with the liberal ideology?

[BCPVP]

1) To repeat, Rove did indeed paint with a very wide brush. But, NEWSFLASH, he's a politician.
2) Now is not a good time for liberals, especially Democrats, to be acting all high and mighty with regards to making generalizations about the other side. Or do I need to dredge up some Dean quotes? Realize, that I'm not talking specifically about you, Greg J, but about liberals in general ( [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]). Nothing personal, man.

That being said, I'm not sure if Rove should have said what he said. While I do agree that while I think some liberals fit the characterization he described, it probably wasn't that great of a political move, imo. Now liberals can fuel off of that for a while, instead of relying on their insane chairman to do all the work.

On a final note, if liberals are really bothered by this, they need to get a life because I've heard almost non-stop how unpatriotic this admin is from the left since '01. Bout time you get some of your own medicine.

[MelchyBeau]

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Interesting. With all the sh*t this administration's put up with from the liberals, it's about time one of them swung back.


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Yes, The Bush administration, nor any of the other big name republicans have attacked any liberal recently except for this one incident.

Melch

[Greg J]

I like that this is leading towards some civil discourse.

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Would you deny that these factions do exist with the liberal ideology?

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No, yr right. We have extremists, well meaning as they may be. I think this is a vocal minority on the left that opposed attacking Afghanistan. It's harder to argue when half the world on on the side of taking them out though (including the cheese eating surrender monkeys).

Many (most?)on the left also want to pull out of Iraq, using that they did not support the war anyhow as their half assed justification. I have made how I feel about his clear elsewhere: I think it's horrible.

[Greg J]

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1) To repeat, Rove did indeed paint with a very wide brush. But, NEWSFLASH, he's a politician.

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Yes, and as a political move, I think this is smart. Rove has orchestrated this technique before, and it works!

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While I do agree that while I think some liberals fit the characterization he described, it probably wasn't that great of a political move, imo.

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I'm not sure I agree.

It worked in 2002 when he he put on a commercial in a GA Senate race that questioned the patriotism of a Veitnam vet that lost 3 limbs, which helped a draft dodger beat him.

It worked in the 2004 Presidential election in general against a decorated war veteran that served two tours on Nam, against a guy accused (rightly or wrongly) of not fulfilling Nat'l Guard obligations.

I'm not trying to dredge up the past so much as point out that questioning the patriotism of the other side is an effective political tactic. I am not sure why it works in such extreme incidents, but it does.

On a side note I will say, in all genuousness, this is scarey to us on the left. It's one reason why there is such vitriol on the left against Rove and Bush -- it seems like a nightmare or an especially scarey Twilight Zone episode.

This is the ultimate play in the playbook for Rove and co. It works EVERY TIME (so far). And it could likely work this time in leading public opinion again.

Then again, perhaps you are right, and he is going to the well once too often. But to quote PT Barnum: "never underestimate the stupidity of the American people." (This probably goes triple for the people of Georgia.)

I honestly don't blame the Republicans for this so much. Rove and co are just being smart, and doing what works. The people eat it up, so why not use it?

[[censored]]

This only works because for whatever reason the left has been associated with a weak military and a pacifist ideology. I'm not really sure where this comes from, my guess is it is Veitnam era leftovers, perhaps the coldwar as well.

I don't think it is true for most liberals/Democrates, atleast the ones I know personally, but my guess would be it sticks until a Democratic President has an opportunity to act decisively in sometype of military action. This really isn't something they can control themselves. It would help though if they made an effort to get on the side of and defend the Military when some of these scandals arise. I don't think it helps the liberal cause to be always seen as opposing the military and it's leaders each and every time there is misstep.

[kurto]

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This only works because for whatever reason the left has been associated with a weak military and a pacifist ideology. I'm not really sure where this comes from

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it doesn't have to come from anywhere. If you demonize your opponents and say it over and over and over again, and the less discriminating members of the party all buy it and repeat it over and over again... its there. It doesn't have to be based on anything. The people who say just have to want to believe it.