hand vs tough player

[TStoneMBD]

25/50 game.

villain is a tough player and his hand range preflop is big. BB is the tight passive player who always defends his blinds from the choose your seat thread. the tough player behind me is the same guy from the QTo thread where he 3bet me and I called OOP with QTo. flop came T36 i checked he bet i called. turn was a blank and it went check check. river was another T i bet and he folded. (WTF??)

in this hand i decided to checkraise right off the getgo because i was afraid hed pull another turn check behind.

i open QJo from the HJ, tough player behind me 3bets in the CO blinds fold and I call.

flop is Q77r

I checkraise, he 3bets I call.

Turn is an A

I check, he bets and I call planning on checkfolding the river.

I think his flop 3bet means he has anything from Qx, JJ-66. I think hed wait till the turn to raise AA-QQ but who knows with this guy. I really don't think he's 3betting the flop with Ax. I am almost certain hes checking behind the river with a hand that I beat (because thats just how he plays) so I think I can safely fold to a bet unless he had QK or something and decided to bet.


hows it look?

[ggbman]

If he really always checks behind the river with hands you beat, there is no other way to play this.

[TStoneMBD]

what if villain might bet the river with worse hands like JJ-66? would you still call the turn and call the river? how about a turn checkraise river checkfold in this spot instead?

[cartman]

If I were villain and you just called the turn I would value bet the river with Q2. So I guess it boils down to how often he has a Q. But since you only get a chop in that case, I would say you are correct to fold the river although I haven't even calculated the pot size.

Cartman

[TStoneMBD]

fortunately villain wont have Q2 in this spot. Id give him QKo and maybe QJs and maybe QTs, so just put QJs if you want to do a hand range. btw he wont always bet Qx there, probably only a portion of the time. he cant think im calling with a worse hand even though i would call JJ in that spot against some players but he cant know that. id also cap JJ preflop against him which he probably does know.

[ggbman]

[ QUOTE ]
what if villain might bet the river with worse hands like JJ-66? would you still call the turn and call the river? how about a turn checkraise river checkfold in this spot instead?

[/ QUOTE ]

Since you seem to have a good idea of how villian will play certain hand ranges on the river, i dont see the point in a c/r. If you do this, he will fold all hands you beat. If you just call, you will get to showdown for 2 the same bets should you opt 2, sometimes he will check behind worse hands and you get to showdown for 1 bet, AND you get another card to improve your hand. Seems vastly superior to me.

[TStoneMBD]

i shouldnt have even asked that question because its obvious how it should be answered.

if the equity i gain from him folding better hands to a turn checkraise minus the times im 3bet on a bluff/2 outter is greater than the equity i gain from him bluffing a better hand on the river then checkraising is better. against most players though a cc cc is superior.

[mmcd]

I'm inclined to 4-bet the flop here and keep the lead in the hand.

[TStoneMBD]

yah this is something i was also thinking about. during this hand i wasnt really expecting to get 3bet all too much by JJ or worse but i know hes certainly capable of it.

he ended up checking the river and showing down 99. now that i know hes capable of 3betting the flop with this hand ill probably play my queens harder in the future. its still not a great spot for me to cap the flop though because i think it lets him get away from his hand easier. maybe if there is a flush draw out there ill cap out of position next time, but rainbow i let him off the hook. even a turn checkraise just lets him fold the worst hand for the same price and lets him extract more when ahead. a river donk makes alot of sense for future hands so i think ill handle this situation by donking the river next time. (assuming of course theres no ace on the turn, etc).

[oreogod]

if he 3bets my flop raiase Im either capping or calling down from that point. Unless I missed something in your read, that is what Id do...but I dont read well.

really not sure on check folding the river, unless you are rock solid in the fact he bets better hand, checks worse ones (and sometimes even checks better ones)