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Old 12-30-2005, 06:53 PM
Nick M Nick M is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 10
Default Pokertracker and squinting at the truth (long)

It's nearly impossible for me to remember everything when I play online. In live play it's a lot easier because I can look at someone's face, and that face reminds me of the hand or hands I've seen him play. Each person looks unique in live play. But online it doesn't seem that way. I feel like I'm not playing people with faces or personalities. It's very tough for me to see someone's screen name and have it trigger something inside my head. So I, like many I feel, have tried to compensate for this by playing when situations are less complicated, for instance Preflop. I think I play MY cards so much more in online SNGs, than in any form of poker I play live. And because of this my view of players skills, tendencies, and absolute donkiness, is skewed. This has never been more apparent then when I bought Pokertracker and loaded my last 500 27turbos into it. I'm not usually a numbers guy. In fact I only do my numbers at the end of the month. I find it keeps me more focused on goals, and less on short term results. I know I'm a winner, but the exact dollar amount I try and keep from myself, until it actually matters.

I can think of 10 great players that I've played with a lot in the past month or so. I recently moved them to the avoid list. Meaning if the tables are filling up quick and I see one of these guys, I'll just skip that one and wait for the next. Well anyway after I got Pokertracker loaded up with my HHs and summaries and the numbers matched perfectly with my excel sheets, I started to check out some of the features. I figured out that I could look at each person's stats, the hands they played, and where and what spots they played them in. This might not be new to others but for me it is. I'm soooo not a numbers guy. I like to play, and try and make it seem less like work as much as possible. I mean this is why I started playing seriously, so I didn't have to crunch numbers all day. That's slowly changing as I look for extra EV in spots I've avoided for so long. So as I was saying, I was looking at people's stats. I thought Id check out some of the players I try and stay away from. I thought I could pick up some information that could help my game a little. Open my eyes to something that could get me that precious EV I'm searching for. Well I found something alright. I looked at a player I thought was good, we'll call him CHIP. I played 10 games with him over a 500 span. He was in the negative, but that wasn't interesting. He obviously can't be judged by that. So I thought I'd look at the hands he's been playing. I saw him playing K10 UTG for a raise, full table level 2. I saw him bluffing every street on hands and pissing away chips. I saw him actually play 610s in middle position for a raise OOP on level 3!!! My eyes squinted as I looked at this. Is this the guy I thought was so good???? It can't be.

See like I said, I play MY cards, MY situations, and MY position, so much in online SNGs. I also 8 table. I also think a lot of us are on Auto Pilot a lot of the time. This isn't a good combination for noticing patterns, tendencies and personalities. The guy I thought was on the avoid list is a freaking FISH!!! And the program I just shook my head at for the past year, had it all there in black and white. We judge people by what we see, and I now realize I don't see much. So I may be playing all the time with people that I should be avoiding, and obviously visa versa.

From now on, Im going to try and dedicate 1 full day a week to note taking on players entire hand history, not just the hands that I see and remember. I actually feel that doing this will make me 30% of the money I would have made, had I played cards instead. I will become better at playing the person with accurate notes. And hopefully I'll find some of that illusive extra EV before long.
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Old 12-30-2005, 07:10 PM
J-Lo J-Lo is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 1
Default Re: Pokertracker and squinting at the truth (long)


just try and focus more... don't try and focus on EVERYEONE at ALL YOUT TABLES, focus on one person per minute/hand and take notes on this person, makes it simpler to get notes on people when u do this instead of tryin to see everythign all the time.
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Old 12-30-2005, 07:15 PM
KingDan KingDan is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 139
Default Re: Pokertracker and squinting at the truth (long)

IMO your time can be better spent elsewhere.

I agree taking notes can be helpful, but I just make a note when a person makes a play out of the ordinary.

Do you play the same people frequently enough to make it worthwhile to have elaborate notes?
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Old 12-30-2005, 07:21 PM
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Pokertracker and squinting at the truth (long)

Make a note when:

Someone makes a really fishy move
Someone is at 4 or more of your tables
You notice someone is playing the bubble in a certain way, if they understand it. And if they dont are they too weak/tight or too loose?

This should certainly be enough to bump your EV up a few tics without too much work.
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Old 12-30-2005, 07:45 PM
bluefeet bluefeet is offline
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: galapagos islands of course
Posts: 825
Default Re: Pokertracker and squinting at the truth (long)

My name is Bluefeet, and I'm addicted to note taking - "Hiiiiiiii Bluefeeeeeeeet".

Of course I generally only 2-table, so I'm certainly not speaking to the true multi-tablers...but I CAN tell you, the notes I've gathered are extremely beneficial. Checking prior to making this post, I have 2,862 unique players noted on the Stars 27&60 turbos. I'm a sick bastard I know.

But for those starting out, or just playing a table or two, I highly recommend it. I'm sitting down with AT LEAST one or two noted at the 60' times, three or four at the 27's. By the end of the game, it is VERY rare that any are left un-noted. Close decisions are effected by these notes in virtually every game. How much this effects my overall success? Beats me. But I'm confident it has been a +EV endeavor.

Aside from the 'future info' aspect, it has taught me a lot about the game. An educational tool in my own development. It's also helpful in keeping me focused on the game while tighty-folding most in the early levels. By the time I'm forced to become more active, I'll have new notes on most at the table -- starting requirements, calling standards, bluffing propensity, etc. While late game strategies shift for many a donk, there are certain characteristics that hold true throughout.

Eh...nuff rambling. Easier done on stars maybe, but again, for those still 1-2tabling, keep that instant HH up and running, making notes along the way. If nothing else, it might shed light on leaks of your own - by analyzing others mistakes.

Ps. I'm aware that adding two more tables, keeping less notes would probably be more profitable. Hard to teach an old dog new tricks [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
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Old 12-30-2005, 08:37 PM
TheNoodleMan TheNoodleMan is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Bloomington , IN
Posts: 325
Default Re: Pokertracker and squinting at the truth (long)

no way is it easier to do on stars than party, the damn focus stealing of stars makes me slow down a bunch of tables whenever I try to take a note on someone.
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Old 12-30-2005, 08:58 PM
Big Limpin' Big Limpin' is offline
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 298
Default Re: Pokertracker and squinting at the truth (long)

Stars damn focus stealing

[/ QUOTE ]

You want to get something called "TweakUI power tools", it allows you the option to override focus stealing (along with many other cool tweaks).
Tweak dat ish
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