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  #11  
Old 12-21-2005, 04:42 AM
Victor Victor is offline
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Default Re: Here\'s a Hand

[ QUOTE ]
I think I fold the river, unless BB is known to be loose aggressive, not just loose.

SGS

[/ QUOTE ]

this is a 6max hand.
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  #12  
Old 12-21-2005, 04:44 AM
Victor Victor is offline
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Default Re: Here\'s a Hand

i would just call pf and try to cr the flop.

otherwise, i like a flop 3bet but your way isnt too bad. i think you just miss out on some value when ahead, which you likely are on this flop.
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  #13  
Old 12-21-2005, 06:17 AM
SGS SGS is offline
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Default Re: Here\'s a Hand

Yea that changes things, but it still seems as though a player would likely not bet Ad,6o on the river or any other pair+flush draw combo that we beat. The way this hand played out it just really seems to me like we are beat here.

SGS
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  #14  
Old 12-21-2005, 08:18 AM
goofball goofball is offline
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Default Re: Here\'s a Hand

I think your mistakes in this hand started before the flop, and you compounded it by putting in a lot of bets when your equity started sucking. It all culminated in being forced to pay off on the river (which I think you should here). But...

Preflop: I'd likely just call. I don't know about building this pot 4 handed in the worst position when it will be too easy to get pushed off the best hand or pay off a better hand.

Flop is fine but I think I'd just 3bet. I see no reason to stop, this is your flop. It super looks like the BB has a decent made/drawing hand and the limper has a naked big diamond. YOu don't say BB is aggressive, he's raising you despite you 3betting out of the SB so his hand looks like a big diamond and an 8 or maybe something stronger, i don't think he's popping you here with middle pair.

On the turn the 8 is about teh worst card for you, I'm ok with betting most turn cards but not this one. BB might be going nutty here but his raise spells doom for you I think. Once CO folds however the chance that our diamond is good plus the size of the pot force a turnand river call.

I think the line I would take is call PF and bet 3bet the flop. Arriving where you did on teh turn check and call/overcall, the check and call but don't overcall the river.
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  #15  
Old 12-21-2005, 09:52 AM
Jeffage Jeffage is offline
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Default Re: Here\'s a Hand

I would do this in a lot of cases. But here, I just saw it as the button isolating the limper with whatever and (even though BB was loose), a 3-bet would likely get him out where two bets might not. There is even the potential of getting the limper out. But even if that doesn't work, I felt strongly I had the best hand. That said, the call-checkraise favorable flop line is also good.

Jeff
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  #16  
Old 12-21-2005, 09:54 AM
Jeffage Jeffage is offline
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Default Re: Here\'s a Hand

[ QUOTE ]
I think the line I would take is call PF and bet 3bet the flop. Arriving where you did on teh turn check and call/overcall, the check and call but don't overcall the river.


[/ QUOTE ]

Though I quibble with you preflop, I see your point. That said postflop, I like your line better than mine in some ways and felt my line was a bit "spewy" here. It's interesting to me though how different good players would approach a hand like this out of position. I think a case could be made for both aggression and passivity here.

Jeff
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  #17  
Old 12-21-2005, 09:55 AM
Jeffage Jeffage is offline
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Default RESULTS

BB had 75o for the flopped straight. At least the diamond outs were clean...Anyone else really fold the end here?

Jeff
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  #18  
Old 12-21-2005, 11:20 AM
Joe Tall Joe Tall is offline
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Default Re: Here\'s a Hand

Unless I'm sure I can get it heads up (and it looks like you can't), I'm just calling w/99 here before the flop. I like my realtive position and want to slip in cheap.

Once the turn pairs it, I'm check-calling there. If he has less, let him bet it, bluffing etc.
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  #19  
Old 12-21-2005, 04:35 PM
SA125 SA125 is offline
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Default Re: Here\'s a Hand

I put him on an 8. When the turn pairs TP and the flop raiser has position, I want to show down the hand as cheaply as possible and go into check/call mode. BB called 3 bets pf so I wouldn't be sure your fl out was clean. I think there's something to be said for weak tight check/calling down when OOP with a hand you want to show down.
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