Flush draw against many opponents + TAG raiser

[Russ McGinley]

Table has been pretty loose-passive with a lot of preflop limpers and cold callers. Button is a TAG who I have not seen make any foolish plays so far. BB is an idiot (67/9.59/1.59) who has been catching cards left and right.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 max, 9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP3 calls, Hero calls, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, SB calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (14 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(7 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP3 checks, Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, SB calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

I liked this flop but I cannot lead. I thought about raising the field but villain on the button is a TAG who most likely had a hand that hit that board and a free card flop raise would not work, however I have a decent draw to the flush + 3 extra outs to the ass end of the straight. Is this a flop I should be raising?

Turn: (10.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(7 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP3 checks, Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, SB calls, BB calls, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP3 folds, Hero calls.

Turn call is getting 13.5-1, nothing to see here.

River: (14.50 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero calls, Button folds, SB calls.

Final Pot: 17.50 BB

This donk bet worried me a bit about a higher flush. I only have the 3rd nut flush with two players yet to act. I think it would be reasonable to expect a maniac BB to hammer away if he had Qc-xc, so really I am more worried about the nut flush. In a big pot like this with the PFR behind me who likely had a hand that coordinates with this board, I elected to go for overcalls rather than raise out the other two.

So my two main questions are:

1. Check-raise the field on the flop?
2. Raise or go for overcalls on the river?

[milesdyson]

not raising that flop is a pretty large mistake. classic spot to pump a strong draw for value. your extra gutshot outs makes the fact that your flush draw is not to the nuts/2nd nuts a lot easier to deal with.

[TripleH68]

I can't think of a reason not to raise this flop.

And you are not drawing to the ass end of the str8 exactly. Only KT will beat you if a 9 falls.
You have all kinds of value to raise this flop.

[Watain]

As someone would say... Don´t be afraid to raise when you have the best of it. Everyone would properbly call the flop and make this an easy value raise. And every hand that would help you on the turn will properbly also help your drawing opponents, making a fancy "wait until the turn, to be able to protect you hand"-move rather non-attractive...

/Torben

[Vote4Pedro]

Youre leaving money on the table failing to C/R that dream flop...

Jack up the river for sure, youre gonna get called by two pair, straights, and perhaps TP

Raise the flop. River is close. I don't mind going for overcalls on the river, though maniac BB very well might be willing to put in 2-3 bets with a lower flush.

[Russ McGinley]

[ QUOTE ]
And you are not drawing to the ass end of the str8 exactly. Only KT will beat you if a 9 falls.

[/ QUOTE ]

What I meant by that is if a 9 fell, I had the ass end of any possible straights.

Thanks for the advice all. I immediately felt stupid after the hand for not raising the flop and didn't want to trick myself into thinking I played it correctly.

[Nick C]

I would checkraise the flop. After I did that, I wouldn't be happy if Button 3-bet and the people behind him started folding, but I think I would take my chances.

The relative position the LAG's river bet comes from is kind of annoying, now that you've made your hand. He probably just has K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] or something. He'll call with that if you raise (I'd imagine), and it's possible Button and SB won't both overcall anyway.

By calling, you do avoid getting 3-bet by BB if he raised with a better flush.

I'd imagine he'd 3-bet with a worse flush as well, though, and that he'd also probably 3-bet with a straight (AT, T9). Would he do it with two pair? I'm not sure, but he is pretty LAGgy.

Would BB go for a checkraise if he had the nut flush? I don't know the answer, but I think it's another question to consider.

In any event, I think I would raise the river.

[bozlax]

C/R the flop. Even if Button 3-bets right after you, you only need, uh, 1 or 2 other people to call to make it for value, and you've got 5 potentials.

I think the river is closer, but I'd raise/call. 2-card flush over 2-card flush is raaaaaare.

[DocMartin]

If you can expect the button to bet after the PFR then the check/raise is the way to go on the flop. Pump that draw while everyone is still willing to pay. Going for overcalls on the river isnt bad but only because you are acting right after the bettor with two left to pay you off, not because you fear the nut flush.