Is ND really deserving for BCS

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Christ give it up with the Stanford game.



[/ QUOTE ]

You mean the way ND fans should give it up with the USC game?

b

[/ QUOTE ]

Why do people do this? You put it in your head that ND fans won't get over this game because that's how you "think" that they would act because of your bias. Go back through the thread and count the times an ND fan has used the USC game as a positive (or bitched about the loss) and then count the amount of time an ND hater has mentioned the Stanford game as a negative? Still wanna make the comparison?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, I think that way because I read about it in every recent thread where there's a comparison about ND and their schedule.

So, Yes. Go back through the numerous BCS who deserves what bowl comparison threads, tally it up, and see which has had more air time. It will still keep coming up.

b

[cokehead]

[ QUOTE ]
Who did weiss recruit that is playing this year?(honest question) Did he bring in any of these breakout players? When was this 'quality' team recruited?

[/ QUOTE ]

the 2005 class, which Weiss barely had a part of, sucked. so far, ND and Weiss have what is considered to be top 2006 class, which will be Weiss's first real recruit class. if you want to say weiss has nothing to do with that and its only about exposure, fine, i don't know how to prove it you.

[ QUOTE ]
But basically you don't think they have any more of an advantage than any other top 10 team at the moment. Fine. Except while the top 10 changes, ND will still be able to recruit more consistently nationwide than any other school.

ND has a bigger audience/fanbase nationwide than any other school. They are the most visible team in college football throughout the season, nationwide. They also get more money than any other school since they don't have to share it with a conference. This also helps in recruiting.

The scholarship cap also affected ND as it affected other 'big' schools. But they will still always draw quality players whether in a down year or an up year. That doesn't necesarily mean that the quality players will play well together for whatever reason.

b

[/ QUOTE ]

I made no comments about how well they played together, it is just generally considered that the last couple classes of ND recruits were not highly sought players. after ND had down years in 2003 and 2004, their following recruiting classes sucked, just like it happens at other schools following down years. they definitely do not always recruit well (meaning that they dont get the top players, not that they evaluate talent poorly). look at school recruit class rankings if you don't believe me. when ND falls out of the top ten, so does their recruiting ability.

[DrunkIrish05]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Christ give it up with the Stanford game.



[/ QUOTE ]

You mean the way ND fans should give it up with the USC game?

b

[/ QUOTE ]

Why do people do this? You put it in your head that ND fans won't get over this game because that's how you "think" that they would act because of your bias. Go back through the thread and count the times an ND fan has used the USC game as a positive (or bitched about the loss) and then count the amount of time an ND hater has mentioned the Stanford game as a negative? Still wanna make the comparison?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, I think that way because I read about it in every recent thread where there's a comparison about ND and their schedule.

So, Yes. Go back through the numerous BCS who deserves what bowl comparison threads, tally it up, and see which has had more air time. It will still keep coming up.

b

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe I'm oblivious, but I don't see this. I think the reason ND fans are in love with ND this year is not due to this game. Many people who haven't watched ND much this year credit this game as to why ND deserves respect, but you will very very rarely hear (or see) avid ND fans mention this game in an attempt to legitimize the team.

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Who did weiss recruit that is playing this year?(honest question) Did he bring in any of these breakout players? When was this 'quality' team recruited?

[/ QUOTE ]

the 2005 class, which Weiss barely had a part of, sucked. so far, ND and Weiss have what is considered to be top 2006 class, which will be Weiss's first real recruit class. if you want to say weiss has nothing to do with that and its only about exposure, fine, i don't know how to prove it you.


[/ QUOTE ]



[/ QUOTE ]

You can't prove it because there is no way to tell how Willingham would've done had he stayed.

3-4 years you'll see how good Weiss is. You can accelerate that if you see him taking kids from Jr colleges to fill holes in the roster and such like you see happening in smaller programs that rebuild quickly. Did weiss do that? (I'm asking as I haven't heard that he did)

What I was saying was, we haven't actually seen how Weiss' recruits will do. Unless there are freshmen or someone that he brought in on this years team making waves. Willingham is also rumored to have a very good recruiting class going right now at the trainwreck that is UW. Who's to say who Willingham would've gotten or how strong the recruiting class would've been had he stayed at ND. Remember alot of people weren't too pleased with how Willingham was let go. It also hurts any recruiting when you don't have a coach in the office. Doesn't matter what school you're at. Which was the case for ND in the recruiting season of 2005.

Neuheisel also had great recruiting classes his first couple years at UW. Probably his first couple years at Colorado too.

I think people are putting the cart before the horse when it comes to praising Weiss. It's only been 1 year.

b

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
but you will very very rarely hear (or see) avid ND fans mention this game in an attempt to legitimize the team.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're joking, right? This was their only real tough team on their schedule all year. (Michigan is a maybe)

Btw...I gave alot of respect to the team for playing that game. They were at home, which helps. It also seemed that they were playing very inspired that game. Just as most who played USC is this year. (Fresno St comes to mind even though they did it @ USC)

I think ND is good. Just not good enough to be in a BCS bowl. I don't see them beating any BCS team other than WV. I don't see them beating anyone in the top 10 BCS except maybe Oregon.

b

[roundest]

[ QUOTE ]
But basically you don't think they have any more of an advantage than any other top 10 team at the moment. Fine. Except while the top 10 changes, ND will still be able to recruit more consistently nationwide than any other school.

ND has a bigger audience/fanbase nationwide than any other school. They are the most visible team in college football throughout the season, nationwide. They also get more money than any other school since they don't have to share it with a conference. This also helps in recruiting.

The scholarship cap also affected ND as it affected other 'big' schools. But they will still always draw quality players whether in a down year or an up year. That doesn't necesarily mean that the quality players will play well together for whatever reason.

[/ QUOTE ]

This simply isn't true. "Regardless of whether or not they have an up year or down year?" Last year's recruiting class wasn't even top 25. I believe the year before that it wasn't even top 40. This is not indicative of a school "that can recruit more consistently nationwide than any other school."

The #1 problem that Notre Dame has had over the last 15 years or so is recruiting. The issue is their academic standards. They cannot compete for the same players as other big college football programs because so many of them don't qualify academically at ND.

Lou Holtz was behind the scenes begging the powers-that-be to lower the academic standards for athletes before he left. He was frustrated with the number of potential recruits being turned down year-in and year-out. If ND had let Holtz have his way, he would have been around much longer.

[cokehead]

Thank you roundest. Bernie and others can continue to hate ND for reasons that simply aren't true.

Bernie, Washington's recruiting class for this year was never rumored to be good. Willingham's recruiting at ND dropped before he was fired.

All I said anyway was that Weiss has had a positive effect on ND's recruiting so far, even all the ND haters who know anything on the subject agree with that.

[trotski]

Now those might be some odds worth considering. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] This team is going to scorch people next year.

Didn't realize there was so much ND hate in here. [censored] the Ducks, Bellotti is a douche.

[SinCityGuy]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The purpose of the BCS is to select two teams to play in the National Championship game.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's the 2 best and deserving teams to play in the NC game.

Well they've certainly screwed that up the last 2 years.



[/ QUOTE ]

It's better than nothing.

Without the BCS, last year USC would have played in the Rose Bowl, Auburn would have played in the Sugar Bowl and Oklahoma would have played in the Orange Bowl.

[TheHip41]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why does everyone think tOSU or Penn State would crush ND? Notre Dame was a reggie bush push away from beating the #1 team in the nation. So for what possible reason can you think that a 5th or 6th ranked team would destroy them? I am thinking it has to be anti-ND bias.

[/ QUOTE ]

Penn State and OSU were both able to beat MSU... easily. I don't think either team is a 2 TD favorite over ND. A 5-7 point range is appropriate.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think if Penn State or Ohio state played MSU that week, they might have lost then. I am a UM/MSU fan, so I watched most of the games, and was at the PSU/MSU finally. Michigan state woefully underacheived.

Seriously, if John L. Smith wasn't a douche, no one would be having this conversation, because michigan state would have been up by like 13 at the half at tOSU, and would have won that game.

Point is, the MSU team from the first 5 games was a waaaay different team than the MSU team from the last 5 games. And for the record, OSU really got dominated by MSU, they just made a big play on special teams, and got a few really nice long pass plays when it mattered.