Flush draw

[Easystreet]

PokerStars 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (4 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB folds, MP2 folds, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises</font>, Hero calls.

I semi bluff the flop with my flush draw, but then get raised by CO. He probably has top pair, but he is capable of raising here with a flush or straight draw himself. Would anyone 3 bet the flop?

Turn: (4 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">CO bets</font>, Hero calls.

Well villain did not take a free card, so that makes his flop raise less likely to be a semi bluff I think. If villain has top pair, I have picked up more outs to trips or two pair.

River: (6 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">CO bets</font>, Hero ????

Is it worth calling with my pair of fours?

[POKhER]

no.
Folds.

[stuartharris]

I like the bet out on the flop, but don't 3-bet against one opponent.

Fold the river. There's no way this is good 20% of the time.

[kapw7]

Check the flop and depending on who bets first, raise (early bettor) or call.
If you think he is capable of raising with a draw then call the river as well. You need this to work 12.5%

[HouseCalls]

*grunch*
Preflop - I complete here also since I'm following SSH's guide but I have to say I end up hating this plsy alot. Anybody else feel queezy when they complete SB with two small non-connected suited cards? Has anybody given this up?

Flop - Would not semi bluff here; you are unlikely to get all three players to fold and you don't really want to play this heads up with since your high card strength sucks. You have 9 outs to a flush so sbout 36% equity which means you'd like to have 3 callers minimum; if you can't pick up the pot you probably don't want to drive anyone out.

Turn - 9 outs to flush gives break even odds of 4.1:1 With only 5BB in the pot if you think there is much of a chance he has a higher fludh draw this becomes a marginal call. If you had not raised on the flop the pot would probably be only 3BB and you would probably lay it down. As it is your "semi bluff" probably committed you to a pot you'd rather not be committed to.

River - seems like the only think you can beat is a bluff (busted flush draw) or the unlikely pair of 3's. The pot odds give you 7:1 so if you think this is a bluff more than 1 in 7 times then call. Given the action I'd fold.

[Str8Fish]

In SSHE, pg 134 has a very similar example of this hand. They say do not try to protect this hand by raising with no overcards to your flush draw. On page 156, you should read the footnote: You should sometimes call and not raise(when)... "you have a small straight or flush draw with no overcards. Since you will probably win only if you make your draw, but you will almost certainly win if you do, you do not need to protect your hand." Hopefully I'm allowed to quote the text... if not, tell me and I'll edit it all out.

[Easystreet]

[ QUOTE ]
Turn - 9 outs to flush gives break even odds of 4.1:1 With only 5BB in the pot if you think there is much of a chance he has a higher fludh draw this becomes a marginal call. If you had not raised on the flop the pot would probably be only 3BB and you would probably lay it down. As it is your "semi bluff" probably committed you to a pot you'd rather not be committed to.

River - seems like the only think you can beat is a bluff (busted flush draw) or the unlikely pair of 3's. The pot odds give you 7:1 so if you think this is a bluff more than 1 in 7 times then call. Given the action I'd fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you for taking the time to write a very detailed reply, I think you may have miss read the hand history slightly however.

I have more than 9 outs on the turn, on the turn I picked up a pair, so in addition to the flush draw I also have outs to two pair or trips.

Secondly I did not raise the flop, I bet out the flop, and villain raised it.

[istewart]

Check the flop. Fold river.

[Weatherhead03]

Check/call the flop, dont lead out. Fold the river.

[HouseCalls]

[ QUOTE ]


I have more than 9 outs on the turn, on the turn I picked up a pair, so in addition to the flush draw I also have outs to two pair or trips.

Secondly I did not raise the flop, I bet out the flop, and villain raised it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry miscounted the turn (too early in the morning I guess)

As for the flop my question is why bet here - you are unlikely to pick up the pot here and if you can't do that you probably want to keep people into to pay you off if you make your draw. I would just check and call here rather than lead out.