Ultra high buy-in SnG...beatable?

[Daliman]

[ QUOTE ]
I was writing two last posts. One of them to you and one of them to Yugoslavia. If you made this post to get me to write one more you won. Did I ever say anything about making a lot of money, playing with somebody famous, playing in an ultra high limit game? Nope.

I am merely disputing your thoughts, opinions, and playing ability.

Am I going to say anything about where and what I play now? nope. But I am happy for you that you occasionally get a thrill out of beating some tv names in online games you have a huge negative EV in.

[/ QUOTE ]

*sigh*

That's all ya got, huh?

pwn3d.....

[adanthar]

Astro wasn't 12 tabling (wasn't it 4?) and he's long since gone past 3/6. I don't think he was around when I played unless I don't know one of his screen names, and he played when the tables were significantly fishier (they've tightened up since then).

No doubt Astro/anyone else good could still beat those games 12 tabling but not for 3 an hour or even close. The whole reason they've tightened up is because 3 people per table are eight tablers now.

If you said 5/10 6 max, we could talk. Maybe. But the swings in that game make the BR requirements just about equal.

[ShamaLamDingDong]

[ QUOTE ]

-What do you think will be the highest buy-in next year? in 2 years? etc.

-Will there be any whales playing these games?

-Could the worlds best SNG player beat the vig versus 9 other pros? 8 pros, 1 fish?

[/ QUOTE ]

-Right now 5k heads up matches are available as are 1k sit n gos. I'd imagine the sit n gos will get up to the 5k level but I don't see them going higher than that in the next few years.
-whales player every game. they will be rare at these limits but will still play.
-Yes and Yes.

SHAMA LAMA...DING DONG!

[ShamaLamDingDong]

This is crazy talk. You think the best sng players in the world play 215 sngs? Why would they possibly play such low limits. It would be a waste of their time and talent.

[ QUOTE ]
Illl bet if XYZ poker star sat down at a 30+3 he would have a lower roi then me until he learned the game style.

[/ QUOTE ]

If XYZ poker star = world class player then you need to get a SERIOUS reality check. I would venture to guess that most if not all world class players who play regularly have played more than a few 1 table sit n gos. Even if they hadn't it would take them all of less than 100 to be crushing the 30+3's for enough to make your earn seem laughable in comparison.k They are called world class players for a reason...because they outclass everyone else in all aspects of poker. All the little bets they save and pots they win here and there that you don't add up to a huge ROI.

SHAMA LAMA...DING DONG!

[ShamaLamDingDong]

Are you for real? I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not.

SHAMA LAMA...DING DONG!

[ShamaLamDingDong]

Ok so you aren't being sarcastic.

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The top players at party are among the top players in the world for that structure currently playing, period, and many excellent NL players have a hard time adjusting to them.

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Someone said something similar earlier and I just can't agree with this. The top palyers in the world at sngs don't waste time with 215's. A player of Daniel Negreanu's caliber would beat teh 215's for much more than you and the other players you listed (I'm assuming none of you come close to his natural talent which is a pretty safe assumption). He wouldn't just run over the game or anything like that. But in certain situations he would be making slightly better decisions (mostly earlier in the tournament but also later in the tournament with a big stack vs Big stack) All these little decisions spread out of many sngs add up to a huge ROI boost. Do you not agree?

SHAMA LAMA...DING DONG!

[ShamaLamDingDong]

I'm not sure about 3x as much but 2x as much seems completely reasonable for the best of the best.

SHAMA LAMA...DING DONG!

[Daliman]

[ QUOTE ]
Ok so you aren't being sarcastic.

[ QUOTE ]

The top players at party are among the top players in the world for that structure currently playing, period, and many excellent NL players have a hard time adjusting to them.

[/ QUOTE ]

Someone said something similar earlier and I just can't agree with this. The top palyers in the world at sngs don't waste time with 215's. A player of Daniel Negreanu's caliber would beat teh 215's for much more than you and the other players you listed (I'm assuming none of you come close to his natural talent which is a pretty safe assumption). He wouldn't just run over the game or anything like that. But in certain situations he would be making slightly better decisions (mostly earlier in the tournament but also later in the tournament with a big stack vs Big stack) All these little decisions spread out of many sngs add up to a huge ROI boost. Do you not agree?

SHAMA LAMA...DING DONG!

[/ QUOTE ]

You misread my post. I never said the best players in the world are pl;aying $215's. I said the best players inthe world for that structure are playing there currently; there is a defference. Would Ivey or Negreanu do better? I'm sure of it. Take them 50-100 to get the strategy changes down, i'd think, but yes, either coulda definitely be the best there. Many decision late strictly come down to pot odds and aggressiveness gauging, and many plays are either right or wrong, period. There is not as much time to "outplay", nor as much opportunity, as often, even at level 1, players are willing to go or call allin with top pair or worse. This ain;t like WSOP, where players usually try to protect their stack like their children. Huge ROI boost? Sure, but incrementally huge, not (DAMMIT! I'M COMPLETELY BRAINLOCKING ON THE PERFECT WORD HERE! I USE IT ALL THE FRIGGIN TIME! AAUGH!) huge by a multiple. I'd liken it to a marathon runner. A good marathoner can run it in 3 hours; the best in the world may be 100X the runner, but 2 hours 6 minutes is about as good as you can get, period. At no time ever in the next 1000 years will anyone run one 2x as fast as the "good" marathoner, cuz the difference just ain't there.

I'd liken myself to being a top marathoner comparatively, consistantly running 2:12-2:15 marathons. Now, If i'm running the greater hartford marathon, i'm likely top 3 or so, but if the kenyans come over, I'm dead. You'd likely never hear my name, as they are 10x the runner I am, but there is only so much faster they can go, and they will.

[Daliman]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure about 3x as much but 2x as much seems completely reasonable for the best of the best.

SHAMA LAMA...DING DONG!

[/ QUOTE ]

It's not reasonable, or possible. 25% is as high as i can imagine anyone ever beating these for long term, and even that is stretching it BIG Time. 20% is max theoretical earn.

[ricochet420]

I read this whole dam thing!?