|
|
#11
04-14-2005, 01:47 AM
|
|||
|
|||
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
Calling the cap on flop potoddswise is fine.
But you got to think that MP2 will raise turn, and it could get capped. You should definitely look at it as a very possible 25.56:4 odds (Assuming A is no good). I don't think you are +EV even if the A counts as some outs. Being sandwiched b/t bettors sucks. 
|
|
#12
04-14-2005, 02:48 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
[ QUOTE ]
MP3 is a LP-P moron. SB is LA-A and MP2 is a smart sLA-A. Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter Preflop: SamIAm is UTG+1 with Jh, As. 1 fold, SamIAm raises, 1 fold, MP2 3-bets, MP3 calls, 2 folds, SB calls, 1 fold, SamIAm calls. Flop: (13 SB) Th, 2s, Qc (4 players) SB bets, SamIAm raises, MP2 3-bets, MP3 calls $4.25 (All-In), SB caps, SamIAm calls, MP2 calls. Turn: (13.56 BB) 3c (4 players, 1 all-in) SB bets, SamIAm folds, ... The pot's big and I have an overcard and a gutshot straight. That means I'm not gonna fold, so I should raise to try to clear my ace draw. I think it's a good raise against a maniac. I don't like being 3-bet, and the cap should have terrified me. I think I should have folded to the cap, because suddenly my ace outs seem less likely and the king outs aren't strong enough. The problem was, I realized this on the turn, and folded there. I now wonder if I should have called THIS bet, just on the K draw. Now raising doesn't clear any outs I value, so maybe call? I don't want to see another raise, and definitely not a 3-bet, but is the draw worth it? -Sam [/ QUOTE ] You do not call a capped flop and fold to one bet on the turn. That's atrocious. I would call this flop and fold to a 3-bet. The reasoning is that you probably don't have a full 4 outs, and even if you do there are going to be redraws against you. Raising to get a stronger ace to fold is misapplied here; basically you're banking on the fact that MP2 has AK and will toss it here, neither of which are likely enough to raise. Mike
|
|
#13
04-14-2005, 08:18 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
(I'm doing this thing where I don't read replies before posting...)
Your line: Fold the flop when its 2 back to you. My line: I'm stuck between calling the flop and seeing what develops behind me or folding to that one little bet by SB. Tough spot though. (now I'll read the replies....)
|
|
#14
04-14-2005, 08:22 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
First off.... realize that raising the flop doesn't force many draws into making a mistake. Even with your raise, those behind you are facing at least 8:1 money.
Again, think about what types of hands you're trying to push out here. Specifically, what are they?? [ QUOTE ] Heck, you get a higher AF by betting, but also by FOLDING. And ya know what makes him less likely to raise the flop? Raising in front of him. [/ QUOTE ] I really don't think this is true. Adam
|
|
#15
04-14-2005, 08:56 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
[ QUOTE ]
MP3 is a LP-P moron. SB is LA-A and MP2 is a smart sLA-A. Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter Preflop: SamIAm is UTG+1 with Jh, As. 1 fold, SamIAm raises, 1 fold, MP2 3-bets, MP3 calls, 2 folds, SB calls, 1 fold, SamIAm calls. Flop: (13 SB) Th, 2s, Qc (4 players) SB bets, SamIAm raises, MP2 3-bets, MP3 calls $4.25 (All-In), SB caps, SamIAm calls, MP2 calls. Turn: (13.56 BB) 3c (4 players, 1 all-in) SB bets, SamIAm folds, ... The pot's big and I have an overcard and a gutshot straight. That means I'm not gonna fold, so I should raise to try to clear my ace draw. I think it's a good raise against a maniac. I don't like being 3-bet, and the cap should have terrified me. I think I should have folded to the cap, because suddenly my ace outs seem less likely and the king outs aren't strong enough. The problem was, I realized this on the turn, and folded there. I now wonder if I should have called THIS bet, just on the K draw. Now raising doesn't clear any outs I value, so maybe call? I don't want to see another raise, and definitely not a 3-bet, but is the draw worth it? -Sam [/ QUOTE ] Raising the flop sucks. Folding the turn sucks.
|
|
#16
04-14-2005, 08:58 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
[ QUOTE ]
Raising the flop sucks. Folding the turn sucks. [/ QUOTE ] You are about one one thing; wrong about the other. Adam
|
|
#17
04-14-2005, 09:50 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Raising the flop sucks. Folding the turn sucks. [/ QUOTE ] You are about one one thing; wrong about the other. [/ QUOTE ] MP2 is getting 8:1 if he calls hero's flop raise. Can he fold AQ? no. AK? no. AJ? QQ? no. JJ? no. TT no. 99-77? yes. So, you are putiing MP3 on this small range of hands? If so, he should fold for 1-bet. On the turn, hero easily has odds to draw to his gutshot, so where am I wrong?
|
|
#18
04-14-2005, 09:54 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Raising the flop sucks. Folding the turn sucks. [/ QUOTE ] You are about one one thing; wrong about the other. [/ QUOTE ] MP2 is getting 8:1 if he calls hero's flop raise. Can he fold AQ? no. AK? no. AJ? QQ? no. JJ? no. TT no. 99-77? yes. So, you are putiing MP3 on this small range of hands? If so, he should fold for 1-bet. On the turn, hero easily has odds to draw to his gutshot, so where am I wrong? [/ QUOTE ] lol... i purposely didn't say which one you were wrong about. I guess you haven't read this entire thread. Either that, or you're not paying attention... Adam
|
|
#19
04-14-2005, 09:59 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Raising the flop sucks. Folding the turn sucks. [/ QUOTE ] You are about one one thing; wrong about the other. [/ QUOTE ] MP2 is getting 8:1 if he calls hero's flop raise. Can he fold AQ? no. AK? no. AJ? QQ? no. JJ? no. TT no. 99-77? yes. So, you are putiing MP3 on this small range of hands? If so, he should fold for 1-bet. On the turn, hero easily has odds to draw to his gutshot, so where am I wrong? [/ QUOTE ] lol... i purposely didn't say which one you were wrong about. I guess you haven't read this entire thread. Either that, or you're not paying attention... Adam [/ QUOTE ] My name is Donk for a reason. he has odds to call the turn because it is actually an 8, not a 3.
|
|
#20
04-14-2005, 10:06 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: AJo: Folding good money after bad?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Raising the flop sucks. Folding the turn sucks. [/ QUOTE ] You are about one one thing; wrong about the other. [/ QUOTE ] MP2 is getting 8:1 if he calls hero's flop raise. Can he fold AQ? no. AK? no. AJ? QQ? no. JJ? no. TT no. 99-77? yes. So, you are putiing MP3 on this small range of hands? If so, he should fold for 1-bet. On the turn, hero easily has odds to draw to his gutshot, so where am I wrong? [/ QUOTE ] lol... i purposely didn't say which one you were wrong about. I guess you haven't read this entire thread. Either that, or you're not paying attention... Adam [/ QUOTE ] My name is Donk for a reason. he has odds to call the turn because it is actually an 8, not a 3. [/ QUOTE ] You've lost me... Anyway, what do you think MP2 will do behind you after you call? Adam
|
 |
|
|
Linear Mode
