how much do you raise the turn?

[jsnipes28]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 4 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

BB ($100)
UTG ($104.25)
Button ($27.30)
Hero ($106.65)

Preflop: Hero is SB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Hero posts a blind of $0.50.
[color=#CC3333]Button raises to $2</font>, Hero (poster) calls $1.50, BB calls $1.

Flop: ($6) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] [color=#0000FF](4 players)</font>
[color=#CC3333]Hero bets $5</font>, [color=#CC3333]BB raises to $10</font>, Button folds, Hero calls $5.

Turn: ($26) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] [color=#0000FF](3 players)</font>
Hero checks, [color=#CC3333]BB bets $13</font>, [color=#CC3333]Hero raises to $35</font>, BB calls $22.

River: ($96) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] [color=#0000FF](3 players)</font>
Hero checks, [color=#CC3333]BB bets $24</font>, Hero calls $24.

Final Pot: $144

[orange]

How about leading/3-betting all-in if raised (on the turn)?

I also raise more on the turn as played- $45-50.

[Godfather80]

[ QUOTE ]
How about leading/3-betting all-in if raised (on the turn)?

I also raise more on the turn as played- $45-50.

[/ QUOTE ]

[CobraGoat]

orange,

why do you feel its necessary to raise more than $35?

curious cuz (i suck) i would have made the $35 raise.

edit: i am dumb. i added the pot wrong. 45-50 does make sense.

[jsnipes28]

i just made the calculation, and my raise gave him roughly 3:1 odds on his call with him being a 4:1 dog (assuming he is on a flush draw). It also leaves enough in his stack so that if i call his all-in he will have drawn correctly against me, and thus taken money from me in the long run. However, if i raise to 45-50 i cut his odds to ~2:1 and even if i pay him off on the river he has still made an incorrect call on the turn.

[Godfather80]

[ QUOTE ]
i just made the calculation, and my raise gave him roughly 3:1 odds on his call with him being a 4:1 dog (assuming he is on a flush draw). It also leaves enough in his stack so that if i call his all-in he will have drawn correctly against me, and thus taken money from me in the long run. However, if i raise to 45-50 i cut his odds to ~2:1 and even if i pay him off on the river he has still made an incorrect call on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Very true. As you played, you gave him ~3.3:1 effective odds to call your turn raise. But you also gave him the implied odds he needed as you were going to call his push on the end no matter what. With these implied odds, his turn call was not really a mistake.

[jsnipes28]

Godfather-
Ideally i would love to bet/3bet all-in, but do you think most players will raise their draws after being bet into on consecutive streets? If so, that is by far the best choice. Otherwise, u are certainly right that i should have raised to $50.

The problem is i am never going to get that other $40 or so that he has left because he has no pair...Maybe he calls if an ace comes on the river and he can use that to snap off bluffs. I wonder if check-raise all-in is really that much less +EV because i will win that $40 probably %90 of the time when he folds and the other %10 i get his stack %80 of the time.

[jsnipes28]

my EV calculations are kind of rusty but i gave it a go. I am actually just confused how much/who's money to include in the losing parts of the EV calcs.
If i check-raise all in on the turn there is $39 in the pot and i assigned to him a 90% chance of folding.
.9*39 + .1(.79)*100= $43.1
if u make it 85% that he folds it is:
.85*39 + .15(.79)*100=$45

now if i raise to $50 on the turn and call his all in on the river it becomes:
.79*126 + .21*-169=$64.05
or is it
.79*126 + .21*-212=$55.02