TT allin preflop vs. chip leader -- bad thinking?

[jb9]

I think I made a reasonable play here but would be interested in hearing others opinions .

This was in a Party points freeroll for a WSOP entry, so there are over 500 players and only 1 prize.

We are down to 70 players and I have an average stack. The second break just ended and the first hand is:

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t400 (9 handed) converter

MP1 (t11050)
MP2 (t6740)
Hero (t11479)
CO (t9101)
Button (t25666)
SB (t8073)
BB (t13852)
UTG (t3604)
UTG+1 (t17344)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls t400, UTG+1 calls t400, MP1 calls t400, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>,

I had just been moved to this table and have no reads on anyone (except the small blind who came from my previous table and who seemed to be a decent player), but I didn't want to play TT against so many people, so...

<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t2000</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises to t3600</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds,

The button (table, and I think tournament, chip leader) raises, and it's folded back to me. I don't have a read on him, but I assume he didn't get that many chips without being aggressive and taking risks and so I'm not necessarily facing a big pair here.

Since I really don't believe I'm better than most of the remaining 70 players (I've only played about 10 MTTs...), I decided that I would have to take some chances and get lucky to have a good chance to make the final table with a decent stack.

I considered calling and seeing a flop, but that didn't feel right... Folding felt worse... So, I reraised allin and hoped he'd fold or call with something I had a decent chance against.

If the tournament had paid for more than 1st place, I think I might have played a little more carefully and worried about just making it in the money. But since this was an all or nothing tournament, I thought it made more sense to take a reasonable shot at becoming one of the chip leaders with 70 players left.

So, does this seem like an especially bad choice or a reasonable risk?

Thanks.

[frozenhops]

The Button has the sneaky smell of AA/KK here by the min- reraise, but, given that this is a winner take all tourney and that you will realistically need to have some luck in the tourney to win. If you fold you are at 9k chips, the tourney chipleader will have 30k or so, and there will be tons of other players with more chips than you.

If you win and villian doubles you up, including the 1800 in dead money in the pot you'd have $25k and prob the chiplead in the entire winner takes all tourney.

If you call you will be pushing in $1600 more chips to win $7.4k (assuming no other calls). Also, your implied odds of hitting your set (and assuming the chiplead will take his AA/KK all the way) would add an additional amount to the pot. If high cards hit on the flop, you can release and you will be dealt a heavy blow, but not out of the tourney if you decide to fold.

I can see folding this preflo, but not in a winner takes all tourney

[durron597]

With 3 limpers preflop, I probably limp with my TT and play them for set value.

[bruce]

With limpers already why not call BTF and play your hand for set value in the hopes of doubling up. TT looks pretty, but
is not that strong a hand. With the blinds and the limpers and now your raise the pot becomes very attractive for the chip leader, who I'm sure is aggressive.

If I am faced with your problem I probably call with mixed
blessings. I smell a bigger pocket pair, but on my good days I'm in a race and my pair holds up. This being a winner take all tourny, at some point you are going to require luck and hopefully this will be it if you are to win.

Bruce

[MSUcougar]

[ QUOTE ]
With 3 limpers preflop, I probably limp with my TT and play them for set value.

[/ QUOTE ]
I strongly disagree. With 3 limpers before you, TT is a perfect hand to make a large raise with here... if the blinds were a little bigger I'd even consider pushing here. I think you have to play TT like the hand it is in this spot (the 5th best starting hand in Holdem).

My interpretation of the big stack's minraise is an attempt to isolate with you and keep the limpers from calling. I have a feeling he has a good (but not premium) hand such as AJ or 88. Obviously, you'd prefer for him to have 88 in this spot.

ESPECIALLY in a tournament with a format like this, I'd be very willing to play this hand for all my chips. Doubling up gives you plenty of chips to push the table around, and if he has AA, then oh well it was just a freeroll anyways.

PUSH.

edit: I'm gonna assume that the mere fact that you posted this hand means that you got all in and he showed AA/KK etc and you busted. I still think it's best to be aggressive in a spot like this...

[locutus2002]

I don't think I'd raise here given the extraordinary payout structure. You want to win a big pot after you flop a set.

Under normal circumstances I would raise here most of the time, but I think your raise was a little small and you would normally be facing 3 or 4 callers, who will all be getting great odds to make the call.

I would raise here to at least T2500. As it happened you ran into an unlikely reraise.

After the raise there's about ~T8000 in the pot and it costs you T1600 to call. I call because the pots laying you better than 4:1 and BB will have to make a continuation bet.

[DireWolf]

[ QUOTE ]

With limpers already why not call BTF and play your hand for set value in the hopes of doubling up. TT looks pretty, but
is not that strong a hand. With the blinds and the limpers and now your raise the pot becomes very attractive for the chip leader, who I'm sure is aggressive.


[/ QUOTE ]

IMHO, this is the perfect time to raise preflop. Punish the limpers. the pot is juicy enough with the limpers that you would be happy to take it down, but its not bad if you are called.

Also, if you feel this makes the pot sweeter for the button, isn't that a good thing? Its not like your stealing here. You will have the better hand a good percent of the time.

[jb9]

Thanks for the comments.

FWIW, he called me with AQo and got the A on the river.