How much money do you need? - Page 8

grandgnu · #71 07-30-2005, 11:40 PM

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Do you even understand the concept of tax deductions?

Even if he was taxed at 50%, he's still giving 50% of his money away. Being the highest tax bracket in the US is 35%, he is effectively giving away .65 cents on the dollar of his own money. And that takes into consideration that the money owed to the IRS is less greater than or equal to 35% of his total donations.

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The current tax system is messed up. The laws are written so confusingly that there is a lot of debate over whether the majority of workers in the U.S. are actually responsible for "income taxes".

Laws can be written in a manner that is inconsistant with common sense. Words can be twisted to take on new meanings that one might not realize unless they poured through hundreds or thousands of pages of code.

An example is that a law might reference "person" but later on in the law it defines "person" as not just what you'd think a "person" is, but also a corporation as being a "person"

Hell, they could say "anyone wearing a green shirt will go to jail"

And a hundred pages down say "for the purpose of this law, green means pink, and shirt means pants!" and they could get away with it.

I still say, fight the powah! Abolish the IRS and the Republic, and allow more poker rooms here in the North East so Foxwoods isn't taking 20-25% rake in tournament entry fees!

Jaskohouston · #72 07-31-2005, 12:55 AM

What you are missing in all this is that capitalism and the free market allow for more personal freedom and creating your own path more than any other economy, and in my opinion there is nothing wrong with that.

Why should ANYONE be able to tell you how much you deserve to have, or what your family deserves to have? Shouldn't you be able to provide for yourself and your family as you wish?

Why you would worry, or care about, what Bill Gates has or makes, I don't know. Whether or not you feel like he has too much, or doesn't do enough with his money, is irrelevant.

We live in a society/economy with more economic and entrepreneurial freedom than anywhere else in the world by a LONGSHOT. And while the upper echelon of people control a large portion of the wealth, these are still the people that run/own businesses, where many of us are employed and have the ability through that to provide income, health care, and numerous other benefits to their families.

And all of this has only led to an economic stability and quality of life that is equaled by few places in the world.

grandgnu · #73 07-31-2005, 08:07 AM

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What you are missing in all this is that capitalism and the free market allow for more personal freedom and creating your own path more than any other economy, and in my opinion there is nothing wrong with that.

Why should ANYONE be able to tell you how much you deserve to have, or what your family deserves to have? Shouldn't you be able to provide for yourself and your family as you wish?

Why you would worry, or care about, what Bill Gates has or makes, I don't know. Whether or not you feel like he has too much, or doesn't do enough with his money, is irrelevant.

We live in a society/economy with more economic and entrepreneurial freedom than anywhere else in the world by a LONGSHOT. And while the upper echelon of people control a large portion of the wealth, these are still the people that run/own businesses, where many of us are employed and have the ability through that to provide income, health care, and numerous other benefits to their families.

And all of this has only led to an economic stability and quality of life that is equaled by few places in the world.

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I'm not arguing that we don't have it better than the majority in the world. I'm saying that we still have a LOT of room for improvement.

I believe about 5% of the population controls around 70% of the money/assets, correct? Does that seem balanced to you?

Quicksilvre · #74 07-31-2005, 12:46 PM

Thanks for the total threadjack, guys.

Who's the member who has the penguin smacking down the other penguin as his avatar? I can't find it, and I didn't want to interrupt any enriching conversation to ask.

TheBlueMonster · #75 07-31-2005, 01:07 PM

16.75 billion dollars should cover my most basic needs: housing, food, fleet of stealth bombers, clothing etc.

grandgnu · #76 07-31-2005, 01:11 PM

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Thanks for the total threadjack, guys.

Who's the member who has the penguin smacking down the other penguin as his avatar? I can't find it, and I didn't want to interrupt any enriching conversation to ask.

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I was waiting for us to get moved to the politics thread.....

Bobby Cannoli · #77 07-31-2005, 04:34 PM

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I believe about 5% of the population controls around 70% of the money/assets, correct? Does that seem balanced to you?

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Well, since the top 5% pays 90% of the income taxes, I think it seems fine.

grandgnu · #78 07-31-2005, 05:37 PM

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I believe about 5% of the population controls around 70% of the money/assets, correct? Does that seem balanced to you?

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Well, since the top 5% pays 90% of the income taxes, I think it seems fine.

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WRONG!

They pay 53.8% according to a 2002 study. But let's not forget that people with those levels of income are quite adept at finding ways to lessen their tax burden (i.e. they have access to resources most of us cannot afford, to find ways of using their money to provide deducations and lowered liabilities)

fimbulwinter · #79 07-31-2005, 06:54 PM

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Capitalism sucks. I could make a million dollars a day, FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE, and not have as much money as Bill Gates has right now.

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Yeah that sounds terrible.

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I'm not saying it would be terrible to make a million a day. I'm saying that no one needs that kind of money, and it's that type of imbalance that is what's wrong with Capitalism.

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and im saying you're a genuine idiot who doesnt understand the motivating orces behind capitalism.

hint: if capitalism didn't exist, everyone would be much poorer, not just the rich.

fim

grandgnu · #80 07-31-2005, 09:08 PM

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Capitalism sucks. I could make a million dollars a day, FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE, and not have as much money as Bill Gates has right now.

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Yeah that sounds terrible.

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I'm not saying it would be terrible to make a million a day. I'm saying that no one needs that kind of money, and it's that type of imbalance that is what's wrong with Capitalism.

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and im saying you're a genuine idiot who doesnt understand the motivating orces behind capitalism.

hint: if capitalism didn't exist, everyone would be much poorer, not just the rich.

fim

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there's no need for name calling. But look back 40-50 years ago. We had a system where there was one breadwinner and they could support families of 4 kids or more on the sole income, and they owned homes.

Nowadays, the majority of youth growing up will hard pressed to:

1. Get out and stay out of debt

2. Afford to purchase a home before they're 30-4 years old, some will likely never be able to afford it

Now you have two breadwinners and they struggle to support one or two children. There is little job security anymore, stress levels are higher, our people are getting fatter because they're depressed and worked to the bone.

Our economy is killing us socially, for the benefit of 5% of the population, and it's not right.

Rome was a great nation that eventually fell. We've already had our golden age, and we are crumbling now as well. It's only a matter of time.

As far as "motivating forces" behind Capitalism, it's a system that encourages people to work hard and compete, which is good for the economy and our advancement. While Communism failed to give anyone a reason to work hard because there was little opportunity for advancement.

There are plenty of people who got into positions of power through inheritance, or just by being BS artists who get credit for their underlings work and couldn't survive in their jobs without it (at least in my experience, which involves a lot of family-owned and operated businesses, blech)

And yes, I understand that the same system that allowed us to have the one breadwinner supporting a large family is the same Capitalism we have today. The problem is that over time the large amount of corruption in the system has presented a variety of social and economic problems that are only getting worse.

I would prefer a system that fosters cooperation, as opposed to stepping on someone to get ahead. That would be evolution for us as a people