Blackjack and Sidebets (PP), beware!

theben · #1 10-09-2005, 12:05 AM

After reading numerous posts here, I've seen some people say that the addition of the side bets/BJ might be beneficial to good players by bringing in or retaining more 'fish' to the party. The reasoning is that the fish would enjoy these -EV features because they enhance the overall experience. Through this heightened experience, some reason there will be more vending machines attracted to PP. However, the addition of these new features may actually have the opposite effect. As you read this, please bear in mind everything here is speculation, and I am just tossing out some ideas. I cannot actually predect what will happen.

1. BJ - - Although the BJ tables should bring in a few more fish to PP, they will result in drawing a lot more fish away from poker to the blackjack games. Rather than dumping money to the good players and the rake, they'll sit at the BJ tables and give it to the house. This is not the only problem: BJ will not only draw fish away from the tables, but it'll also drain thier rolls and prevent them from returning to the tables. The money will flow to the house from BJ games and won't ever get to be risked on the poker table.

2. Sidebets - - I see the sidebets possibly attracting more fish to PP and also keeping them at the table. (BJ may bring some more fish to the site, but pull many away from the tables. fortunetly, sidebets wont directly draw players away). Good thing about the sidebets is that it doesnt draw away players. The bad news? Its highly -EV and could very quickly drain the fishes rolls, eventually making them leave. I dont know its exact -EV value, but i saw house edge was about 17%. This could quickly consume fishes rolls and the money will never reach the tables for us to grab [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

The verdict:

This might make PP more profitable but it may hurt us. If the fish go broke more quickly, it could also lead to a gradual decline in fish presense at the tables which could eventually destabalize the 'partypoker online economy'.

These new features might add some quick revenues, but they will definetly not add as much as they take in because the BJ and sidebets will surely canabalize some rake away. With decreased action at the tables, who knows what type of effects this could have.

UATrewqaz · #2 10-09-2005, 12:12 AM

Without question this is bad news.

Fish are gonna throw away all their money no matter what. They wanna gAmb0L.

There is only so much meat on their bones and every bite PP takes is a bite we won't get.

Good players will not play these side bets, only bad.

It will basically result in a shorter lifespan for fish.

Your typical fish probably makes 1 initial deposit, plays for awhile, busts and never comes back, or perhaps maybe makes another deposits and then after that bust never comes back.

These -EV games will expedite the process. In fact after losing alot at poker they might LIKE BJ better, because they feel like they have a 50/50 chance of winning each hand, whereas it's alot "harder" to win a poker hand.

They don't care the are losing money, they like to "win" hands.

primetime32 · #3 10-09-2005, 12:17 AM

this will certainly hurt most of us. Losing money in blackjack is so much easier and is far more addicting.

Petro · #4 10-09-2005, 12:42 AM

The sidebet feature will add a new dimension to the "party is rigged" conspiracy. So that's +EV in the entertainment aspect. I think that's the only positive.

krimson · #5 10-09-2005, 12:45 AM

BJ is certainly a bad thing. The fish will take some hits, and attempt to make up the money by taking the last of their deposit to a BJ table rather than buying in short at the higher limits.

stocktrader23 · #6 10-09-2005, 12:50 AM

I don't like blackjack and side bets being added but to think it will dry up the fish population is silly. Hell half the people on this forum that play all the time are fish, they just don't realize it. Poker is a game where a horrible player can make a ton of money from time to time. These bad players remember this and ignore the 22 deposits they've made over the last year. Hey they won $200 on Friday and post at 2 plus 2 so they must be great!

theben · #7 10-09-2005, 09:48 AM

i dont like the idea of BJ drawing away the morans

cardcounter0 · #8 10-09-2005, 09:55 AM

Fantastic Analysis!

Now can you shed some light on the subject of "if you stand in the rain, you might get wet"?

#9 10-09-2005, 09:59 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Fantastic Analysis!

Now can you shed some light on the subject of "if you stand in the rain, you might get wet"?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah come on, everyone knows, if you stand in rain you get more wet than if you run.

otctrader · #10 10-09-2005, 10:15 AM

I don't understand the horror over BJ/sidebets - B&M poker rooms, arguably the fishiest in existence, operate a few steps away from all the -EV sucker bets you can imagine.

Online, you're only a few clicks away from casinos anyway, so tilting players have had this option for years. Maybe it's easier now, but I doubt it will significantly decrease our expectation.

Don't forget there's still a psychological allure for a tilting player to "screw over" a human poker player by sucking out versus beating the computer at blackjack.