Collusion at its finest what do you think...?

[BigSkiRace]

PokerStars Game #1622053483: Tournament #7058449, Hold'em No Limit - Level XX (20000/40000) - 2005/05/01 - 22:48:57 (ET)
Table '7058449 169' Seat #3 is the button
Seat 3: Buster Love (3164039 in chips)
Seat 5: Dudley33 (2985491 in chips)
Seat 8: ramco (265470 in chips)
Buster Love: posts the ante 2000
Dudley33: posts the ante 2000
ramco: posts the ante 2000
Dudley33: posts small blind 20000
ramco: posts big blind 40000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Buster Love: folds
Dudley33: calls 20000
ramco: raises 200000 to 240000
Dudley33: calls 200000
*** FLOP *** [Jh 3c Ah]
Dudley33: checks
ramco: bets 23470 and is all-in
Dudley33: folds
ramco collected 486000 from pot
ramco: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 486000 | Rake 0
Board [Jh 3c Ah]
Seat 3: Buster Love (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Dudley33 (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 8: ramco (big blind) collected (486000)

[Pat Southern]

Would have been a lot better if ramco raised to 263469 preflop

[tiger7210]

The flopped missed him. Why waste 20K more chips getting 25-1 on his call.

This guy should be banned cause nobody can be that bad of a player that has made it this far in a tourny.

Just gives all of us hope that we can win the big one.

[Chaos81]

[ QUOTE ]
The flopped missed him. Why waste 20K more chips getting 25-1 on his call.

[/ QUOTE ]
Because if he hits, he'll knock the guy out.

[tiger7210]

[ QUOTE ]
Because if he hits, he'll knock the guy out.



[/ QUOTE ]

I guess you didn't detect the sarcasm in my response. He should have called even if only had 1 card in his hand and it was the Joker.

The whole sequence certainly stinks like something. I just don't really understand what the reasoning could be.

[Siawyn]

God, that looks awful.

[CardSharpCook]

Ok, I know this looks bad, but it can actually make sense. Homeboy with the chips to throw around saw a weak call by the small blind. He looked down at his 95o and said "screw that" and goes to put the SB AI. He miscalculates his bet or doesn't fully think about his bet because he is sure that any bet gets the SB to fold. After the flop comes out, he has only running outs to make a hand and quite frankly, he doesn't want to expose what a bonehead play he just made. So he makes another bonehead play to save a little face.

Weak/Tighties: 1
Boneheads: 0

CSC

[Lee Jones]

Scott Byron and I both reviewed the hand, and we both agree that there was no collusion going on. Obviously, I can't reveal either player's hole cards. But I am 99.99% sure that the play was on the square.

From Dudley's perspective, it wasn't at all clear that he was getting the right pot odds to call. Now, should he call anyway? Perhaps. But now we're having a discussion about poker tactics, not poker ethics, which is where this thread started.

I should also note that ramco (the supposed "dumpee") busted out Dudley (the supposed "dumper") shortly thereafter.

Look, if I'd been Dudley, and I decided to call the raise, I'd have put ramco all-in preflop to make sure I got to see five cards. But again, that's a tactical decision, not an ethical one.

Finally, have you never been in a situation where you call a raise, and then notice that you've left your opponent with some trivial number of chips? And then the flop comes and you realize that if you're really lucky, you might be a 25:1 dog? I mean, maybe you haven't done it, but I have.

There's really nothing here folks, you can move along.

Best regards,
Lee Jones

PokerStars Poker Room Manager

[Chaos81]

[ QUOTE ]

I guess you didn't detect the sarcasm in my response.

[/ QUOTE ]
Seeing as it's the internet, and their are some very stupid people out there, it's hard to tell. Use a [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] next time. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[young nut]

[ QUOTE ]
Ok, I know this looks bad, but it can actually make sense. Homeboy with the chips to throw around saw a weak call by the small blind. He looked down at his 95o and said "screw that" and goes to put the SB AI. He miscalculates his bet or doesn't fully think about his bet because he is sure that any bet gets the SB to fold. After the flop comes out, he has only running outs to make a hand and quite frankly, he doesn't want to expose what a bonehead play he just made. So he makes another bonehead play to save a little face.

Weak/Tighties: 1
Boneheads: 0

CSC

[/ QUOTE ]

homeboy with chips didn't raise preflop, he called the other homeboys raise.

The only reason I can see for a laydown here would be that the guy with the large stack didn't want to give away what type of hands he was calling raises with. That could seem like the only logical reason for a fold here.