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#31
12-14-2005, 05:32 PM
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Re: Coin flip middle of a tourney, do you take it?
While I certainly do NOT argue with anyone advocating a push here, there is another play that could be better --
Calling, and then pushing the flop is not a bad option, if overcards to his pair come on the flop, he cant call. Meaning. If you flat call the 600, and the board comes QT4 and you push to his weak opening bet, then he will have a very hard time calling your all in. By pushing preflop, you make his decision easier, right? Meaning - he can immediately rule out AA-QQ since you wuld mostly not play them so fast. He will probobly and correctly put you on two big cards, and then decide if he wants to take the coin flip (with the heavier side of the coin). So, you made his decision easy. BUT, by just calling you make it much harder on him. You could have ANYTHING. You could be slowplaying aces, you could have suited connectors, you could have a smaller pair. You deprive him of anything that tells him what you really have. THen, he is out of position postflop. If overcards come up, he can't safely push. He can only bet. or check. If he pushes, fine you fold and lose 600. If he checks, you steal the pot. If he bets, you steal the pot. The more I play this game, the more I am starting to look for situations to make my opponent make hard decisions and not easy ones. I think this could be just such an opp. 
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#32
12-14-2005, 05:37 PM
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Re: Coin flip middle of a tourney, do you take it?
[ QUOTE ]
While I certainly do NOT argue with anyone advocating a push here, there is another play that could be better -- Calling, and then pushing the flop is not a bad option, if overcards to his pair come on the flop, he cant call. Meaning. If you flat call the 600, and the board comes QT4 and you push to his weak opening bet, then he will have a very hard time calling your all in. By pushing preflop, you make his decision easier, right? Meaning - he can immediately rule out AA-QQ since you wuld mostly not play them so fast. He will probobly and correctly put you on two big cards, and then decide if he wants to take the coin flip (with the heavier side of the coin). So, you made his decision easy. BUT, by just calling you make it much harder on him. You could have ANYTHING. You could be slowplaying aces, you could have suited connectors, you could have a smaller pair. You deprive him of anything that tells him what you really have. THen, he is out of position postflop. If overcards come up, he can't safely push. He can only bet. or check. If he pushes, fine you fold and lose 600. If he checks, you steal the pot. If he bets, you steal the pot. The more I play this game, the more I am starting to look for situations to make my opponent make hard decisions and not easy ones. I think this could be just such an opp. [/ QUOTE ] Hero is in seat 7. If you think that calling this bet will make the OR check to you, you are engaging in very wishful thinking. Calling here to "re-evaluate after the flop" just accomplishes a couple of really bad objectives: 1) it confronts you with a big flop bet 66% of the time when all you have is Ace-high, but could be way ahead. 2) it gives one or more of the blinds great odds to call and hit their hand.
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#33
12-14-2005, 05:40 PM
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Re: Coin flip middle of a tourney, do you take it?
[ QUOTE ]
By pushing preflop, you make his decision easier, right? Meaning - he can immediately rule out AA-QQ since you wuld mostly not play them so fast. He will probobly and correctly put you on two big cards, and then decide if he wants to take the coin flip (with the heavier side of the coin). So, you made his decision easy. [/ QUOTE ] This is also horrifically results-oriented. We know that villain has 99. How would Villain's decision be easy if he has 44? Or if he has AQ?
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#34
12-14-2005, 06:46 PM
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Re: Coin flip middle of a tourney, do you take it?
My point in pushing preflop in this situation is that you are basically shouting that you have AK or AQ. (ok, maybe small pairs, say 55-99?). My point in offering this alternative line is that by simply calling you are denying the villian information. You keep him guessing and he is OOP pre flop. He then has to decide if he is willing to push or call all of his chips with an underpair.
As I said early in my post, I would not argue with a push and I normally play it like that as well, but after thinking about how easy we made it for the Villian to put us on a hand and make the correct decision (FTOP stuff), I thought that just calling could force the villian to make a mistake.
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