KK form MP

[mab_nyc69]

KK....i raise...button calls (call station...37% vpip). flop rags...high card Q. I bet, button calls. Turn Rag....I bet...call. River...Ace...do you bet here?

[tongni]

If you check, you will only call a bet when you are behind. You have to bet. KQ and much, much less will pay you off.

[YoureToast]

[ QUOTE ]
If you check, you will only call a bet when you are behind. You have to bet. KQ and much, much less will pay you off.

[/ QUOTE ]

Disagree....Any Q avg to low kicker may bet; any failed draw may bet (although all rags, the button may have bottom/middle pair and was drawing to 2 pair)....Checking induces a bluff or a worse hand to bet possibly; betting here gets a pair of queens to call but an Ace to likely raise, costing you 2 bets (unless you fold, which is possible).

[Peter_rus]

Yes, i bet and fold to a raise. Calling station usually don't raise here until you beaten, though he almost always bet hand with ace and check behind lesser holdings if you check and he will call a ton of worser hands that your KK usually including Q,PP and even rag pair occasionally.

[mab_nyc69]

i was raised and called.....not sure what the right play is. Simlar thing happened another hand....I had AA and there was a j on board. I check raised the turn (one player) and the river was another Jack. I bet....and of course....raise. I knew i was beat but im not giving up 15 to 1. any commments?

[mab_nyc69]

i think you're wrong becuase many idiots will still raise JJ to my surprise. the only question is betting risking being raised when an overcard hits or a 2nd jack etc. hits on the river.

[YoureToast]

[ QUOTE ]
i was raised and called.....not sure what the right play is. Simlar thing happened another hand....I had AA and there was a j on board. I check raised the turn (one player) and the river was another Jack. I bet....and of course....raise. I knew i was beat but im not giving up 15 to 1. any commments?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think if you're going to bet against this calling station, you have to be willing to fold to a raise as Peter_Rus mentioned, especially in a relatively small pot. As for the Jacks situation, this is slightly different because it is at least twice as likely that your opponent has the Ace (as opposed to the Jack). Also, you pot odds were better in the jacks situation.

I tend to check in the Aces situation and bet in the Jacks situation, but unlike Peter, I'm very unlikely to fold if raised to (just like you were), although I think he saves a lot of big bets by his willingness to do that.

[Peter_rus]

We are not talking about play against unknowns. He's calling station. CS's are passive, calling sucks, and don't care to read opponent much, isn't it?