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#1
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Checking the flop with a monster on a scary board
I've noticed that on .5/1 Party tables that checking the flop tends to get more action on the turn. The cases that I notice this is when a big hand hits the flop but there is a two flush as well. The pot is too big to make the flush draw wrong with the small bet so I check and wait till the turn to lead out. Here is an example:
Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, UTG+1 calls, MP3 calls. Flop: (10.50 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font> UTG+1 checks, MP3 checks, Hero checks. Turn: (5.25 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 bets</font>, MP3 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG+1 calls, MP3 calls. River: (11.25 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font> UTG+1 checks, MP3 checks, Hero checks. Final Pot: 11.25 BB No, I don't know why I didn't bet the river, bad kero, no biscuit. This example may not be the best because I wasn't even thinking that someone had hit the straight, but since starting to wait to the turn instead of leading out I've noticed that it's like the other players think the flop missed me and are more likely to bet into me with 2nd or 3rd best hands. I'm not using this as a standard line yet because it seems a little too fancy and most flush chasers don't pot odds from pot roast. Thoughts? Edit: Got rid of the straight from the example hand, dissregard anything straight related in this post. |
#2
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Re: Checking the flop with a monster on a scary board
This board is waaaay too coordinated to allow for a free card...I almost never check behind when I was the PFR, but if I do, the flop is usually K72r
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#3
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Re: Checking the flop with a monster on a scary board
I don't like giving free cards. This is too fancy IMO. Just bet they will give you their money.
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#4
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Re: Checking the flop with a monster on a scary board
OK, this is bad example because the board is double coordinated. I should have found an example that didn't include the straight draw.
Forget the straight. Forget the straight. Forget the straight. What I tell you 3 times is true. The point is that the pot is too big to bet someone off a flush draw on the flop. It's a case where betting doesn't improve your odds of winning. Waiting for the turn gives you a better shot at getting rid of a flush draw. Not much with the micro limit players but still. What I've noticed is that when the flush misses the turn I tend to get more action compared to un-coordinated boards where I lead out on all streets. |
#6
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Re: Checking the flop with a monster on a scary board
People have really started to misapply the hand protection "wait for the turn" concept. You can't lose the flush draw, so just bet your hand for value and collect the money. Giving correct odds is better than giving infinite odds.
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#7
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Re: Checking the flop with a monster on a scary board
Thanks for the link gharp, it is a good one.
Looking at a couple of these hands I'm starting to think it is a matter of too much cough medicine and selective memory rather than trickery into getting a lead out turn bet that I can raise for another bet. |
#8
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Re: Checking the flop with a monster on a scary board
[ QUOTE ]
OK, this is bad example because the board is double coordinated. I should have found an example that didn't include the straight draw. Forget the straight. Forget the straight. Forget the straight. What I tell you 3 times is true. The point is that the pot is too big to bet someone off a flush draw on the flop. It's a case where betting doesn't improve your odds of winning. Waiting for the turn gives you a better shot at getting rid of a flush draw. Not much with the micro limit players but still. What I've noticed is that when the flush misses the turn I tend to get more action compared to un-coordinated boards where I lead out on all streets. [/ QUOTE ] In the first place, you're not trying to get anyone off a flush draw. You're trying to increase the amount you win from them the 65% of the time their flush doesn't hit. Second, the last part of this is idiotic. You're going to get LESS action from a flush draw when the turn doesn't hit them, not more. Finally, this hand was badly played, this hand was badly played, this hand was badly played. |
#9
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Re: Checking the flop with a monster on a scary board
I think not betting the flop is pretty bad, but there's a certain logic to it. Still, you're putting yourself in a situation where you could be putting money in only when your behind and none when you're ahead.
And not betting the river is a crime against all the Micro Limits Forum stands for! |
#10
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Re: Checking the flop with a monster on a scary board
you. must. bet. the. flop. big. pot. no. free. cards.
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