Hand I Observed at the Bellagio and Thought Was Odd.

[goofball]

We pick the action up on the flop, in the 10/20 NL game at the bellagio. Villian has around $7k behind and Hero covers. Hero has 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Flop ($300) is K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Hero bets out $300, villian raises to $800, villian calls.

Turn ($1900) is J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Hero checks, villian bets $500, hero raises to $1000, villian calls.

River($3900) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Hero checks...

A limit playing buddy and I watched this take place and thought hero misplayed at both the turn and river but we could be way off.

We thought the check minraise on the turn just sucked balls and that he should have blockish bet the river because what do you do there if villian pushes?

Are we to assume hero opened for $135 here and got a caller behind PF or what?

Depends what kind of player villain is. If he's tight we can put him on AK and play the hand accordingly.
If he's loose, it's harder for us to know if our underfull is good on the turn and river so you have to play it a lot faster. Either way I hate that turn action.

[flawless_victory]

"hero"s play sucks bad.

[Popinjay]

fastplay that shi* on the flop! underfull is vulnerable

[goofball]

[ QUOTE ]
Are we to assume hero opened for $135 here and got a caller behind PF or what?

Depends what kind of player villain is. If he's tight we can put him on AK and play the hand accordingly.
If he's loose, it's harder for us to know if our underfull is good on the turn and river so you have to play it a lot faster. Either way I hate that turn action.

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't see the action PF and am estimating the pot size. COuld have gone open-3bet call or just openbig-coldcall.

[ QUOTE ]
We pick the action up on the flop, in the 10/20 NL game at the bellagio. Villian has around $7k behind and Hero covers. Hero has 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Flop ($300) is K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Hero bets out $300, villian raises to $800, villian calls.

Turn ($1900) is J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Hero checks, villian bets $500, hero raises to $1000, villian calls.

River($3900) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Hero checks...

A limit playing buddy and I watched this take place and thought hero misplayed at both the turn and river but we could be way off.

We thought the check minraise on the turn just sucked balls and that he should have blockish bet the river because what do you do there if villian pushes?

[/ QUOTE ]

Reluctantly fold without a read. Reason for the checks is obviously because the reraising range for villain on that flop include KJ and KQ. Only hand hero beating now is AK and KT and worse. Terrible turn and river cards basically.

I agree turn miniraise kinda sucks, but it's not that bad.

[cero_z]

Hi goofball,

This hand was not necessarily played that badly by Hero. In an online game, Villain's flop raise indicates he has a K a large % of the time; this is not necessarily true in the Bellagio 10/20, which is MUCH weaker in general than, say, the Party $2K game.

If Hero thinks Villain is so bad that a flop raise to 800 means definitely no King, then his mission is just to milk the guy for a medium sized pot (or get him to bluff his whole stack--very unusual), and he played it OK, though a value bet would be called for on the river often.

If he thinks Villain does have a K, then he should've reraised the flop probably, depending on the skill level of his opponent. But, since he didn't reraise, I like his play from that point forward. On the turn, he wants to get some more money in the pot, while at the same time not scaring out trips AND not committing himself when he could possibly be down to 1 out. When that Jack falls, it becomes a lot harder to get action from the hands he wants action from, against a decent-playing opponent. Then, when the Q falls, the situation is worse. A check is probably the right move, though a bet of about 1500 might be best against a predictable and not-too-tight opponent (who would pay off with trips/no kicker, but who would need Ks full to raise).