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#11
04-01-2005, 03:08 PM
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Re: 5/10 Hand (Boring Title; Interesting Hand)
You are assuming that 10-8 is ahead here which may very well not be the case. Betting at the river here will likely only get a call from an overpair or 54 whereas opening the betting again allows a set or the striaght to reraise and Hero would hate to face an all in call for another $500+ depending of size of value bet with 10-8 here after having put more $ in. In short very few hands he has beat are likely to call and hero can't stand a huge reraise so why open the door here?
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#12
04-01-2005, 03:11 PM
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Re: 5/10 Hand (Boring Title; Interesting Hand)
Ooh, this is a good one.
Flop: looks good. You have a nice pair+draw hand, but no nut outs, and you hate a flop 3-bet. Looks like a good time to call and play a small to medium-sized pot. Turn: seems standard. River: I agree, looks like he has a medium-strength made hand. He is happy to see it checked through, or is hoping a busted draw will bluff. He doesn't bet b/c the board is getting a little tricker for his bottom 2 (maybe you have JT, e.g.) and he doesn't want to get raised. So... you bet! he calls with his 54 or 85 or whatever and you win. I think if he has a sure winner (a set or 67) he leads out. No one plays for a double c/r with their big hands like this, or makes a double c/r bluff with a busted draw. I bet 250 or 300 (and fold to a raise, of course). -muz
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#14
04-01-2005, 07:19 PM
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Re: 5/10 Hand (Boring Title; Interesting Hand)
Really? 3-betting seems horrible to me. Villain will probably fold a smaller 2-pair and push with a set or the straight. You are getting nothing more if you are ahead (and villian is probably drawing thin), and you have 11-13 outs if you are behind... betting then calling the c/r seems like a no-brainer. What am I missing?
-muz
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#15
04-01-2005, 08:12 PM
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Re: 5/10 Hand (Boring Title; Interesting Hand)
No, no, I'm not talking about the 3rd bet, I'm talking about making the first bet. In position, out of position, when I hit top 2 and the flush draw I almost always punch it, but I'm beginning to think this isn't the best move...
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#16
04-01-2005, 08:18 PM
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Re: 5/10 Hand (Boring Title; Interesting Hand)
Hey Mike,
Flop: not very debatable. You don't want to lose your chance to play a MUCH bigger pot as a big favorite, which could happen if you raise on the flop. Turn: Again, looks straightforward to me--you must bet, since after just the flop action, you're way ahead, as far as you know, and you want to build the pot. Since your opponent can see the possible straight in this unraised pot, the call (non-reraise) also seems standard. I guess it's en vogue on this forum to push here, but I usually wouldn't. I don't love my made hand at this point. You do a lot better in the long run by letting him keep the lead here, I think. River: Not too debatable either, IMO, since the size of bet you can probably get him to call with a worse hand is probably not worth the risk of getting raised. Which street was of the most interest to you?
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#17
04-02-2005, 12:16 AM
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Re: 5/10 Hand (Boring Title; Interesting Hand)
if he gets raised on the river he must have the best hand, no one c/r 3 times ina row iwth a good hand. if he gets called and losses so what, that own't happen, he'll get called on the river and win.
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#18
04-02-2005, 12:30 AM
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Re: 5/10 Hand (Boring Title; Interesting Hand)
[ QUOTE ]
if he gets raised on the river he must have the best hand, no one c/r 3 times ina row iwth a good hand. if he gets called and losses so what, that own't happen, he'll get called on the river and win. [/ QUOTE ] A Check-raise on the river would certainly reek of a desperation bluff.
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#19
04-02-2005, 12:48 AM
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Re: 5/10 Hand (Boring Title; Interesting Hand)
[ QUOTE ]
if he gets raised on the river he must have the best hand, no one c/r 3 times ina row iwth a good hand. if he gets called and losses so what, that own't happen, he'll get called on the river and win. [/ QUOTE ] From Villians perspective Hero is holding a flush draw here a large percentage of the time. He is holding a set here almost zero persent, and two pair seems strangly unlikely. So if Villian has a straight or a set, he can lead, hoping to get called by what exactly? Or check it to Hero and let him bluff at it? If you are gonna bet this river, you should have raised the turn. I like Mike's play all the way.
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#20
04-02-2005, 12:49 AM
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Re: 5/10 Hand (Boring Title; Interesting Hand)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] if he gets raised on the river he must have the best hand, no one c/r 3 times ina row iwth a good hand. if he gets called and losses so what, that own't happen, he'll get called on the river and win. [/ QUOTE ] A Check-raise on the river would certainly reek of a desperation bluff. [/ QUOTE ] Who check-raise bluffs this river? If Villian wanted to bluff hed lead out at you. If he check raises it means you just got played.
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