Hand

Jason Strasser · #1 03-25-2005, 03:38 AM

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $10 BB (4 handed) converter

Button ($94.80)
SB ($1568.70)
BB ($748.75)
Hero ($1101)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
Hero raises to $30, 1 fold, SB calls $25, 1 fold.

Flop: ($70) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $50, SB raises to $140, Hero calls $90.

Turn: ($350) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets $300, Hero calls $300.

River: ($950) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets $690, Hero calls $631 (All-In).

Final Pot: $2271

Thought: A while ago Diablo was responding to a post and talked about a situation where he would have a hand like AK, flop a pair, and come out firing on the flop and keep going. He wouldnt tell me why.

This hand, without disclosing the outcome, got me thinking about what kinds of spots do really good people find to bet a Q in the spot of the villain in this hand. IE, if I was the villain and I had AQ, when would I know to bet like this, and what situations would merit this type of aggression with one pair?

-Jason

Dr. Strangelove · #2 03-25-2005, 04:13 AM

When you've been getting way out of line and UTG puts you on a draw and is ready to make a big call. K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ?

Dr. Strangelove · #3 03-25-2005, 04:23 AM

This is kind of a funny hand, if SB has a set, why doesn't he lead out with it? If he has a monster draw, why doesn't he lead out with it?

flawless_victory · #4 03-25-2005, 01:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]
This is kind of a funny hand, if SB has a set, why doesn't he lead out with it? If he has a monster draw, why doesn't he lead out with it?

[/ QUOTE ]come on. everyone plays every hand with zero imagination. i guess he doesnt read 2plus2.

Dr. Strangelove · #5 03-25-2005, 11:31 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This is kind of a funny hand, if SB has a set, why doesn't he lead out with it? If he has a monster draw, why doesn't he lead out with it?

[/ QUOTE ]come on. everyone plays every hand with zero imagination. i guess he doesnt read 2plus2.

[/ QUOTE ]

Low blow, but you know what I mean: what hand can you put the guy on if he plays it this way? It's not really standard for either of those holdings.

aggie · #6 03-25-2005, 01:32 PM

If you're saying that small blind has a Q, and you're wondering why he played it that strong, it may be because he's seen you make similar plays before? Of course, i have no way of knowing this.

This hand is very read dependent of the small blind. Obviously you thought he was quite capable of firing 3-shells on a bluff/semibluff. Fine...But if the $300 on the turn is going to make you pot commited, why not reraise all in at that point? I guess you're hoping he gives it up, and you get a cheap show down?

I do think folding the turn is correct against most opponents. Problem is, you might not get paid off if you hit. And you don't know if your J or A outs are good.

Jason Strasser · #7 03-26-2005, 03:03 AM

Your post, I think, has some gaps in its logic.

The key idea is that there are lots of hands he can have here.... Ones that kill the ones I have, and ones that are way behind (busted flush draw or pure bluff). If I raise, then he will fold everything I am ahead of (and possibly a Queen--so for that reason a raise might be good). In this spot I thought he was bluffing, so I called down. Raising someone who you think is bluffing usually has very little value when you have something that beats a bluff (compared to letting him keep bluffing when you are pretty sure he is bluffing).

-Jason

aggie · #8 03-26-2005, 04:43 AM

I pretty much agree with you although you may be discounting the power of moving your opponent off a better hand on the turn. Why did you think he was on a draw. He called $25 out of position before the flop. I suppose he could have K10s.....But would he call with worse spades than that in this position? And if he does have K-10, it might be better to move all in on the turn anyway since a non spade A or 9 would be very bad for you on the river. An A is especially bad since it would make the hand so hard for you to get away from. Would you fold to the river all in if the 9 came instead of the blank? Your argument that you'd rather let him keep on bluffing is valid, but keep in mind that your opponent is reasonably likely to give up the bluff on the river anyway.

Anyway, i suppose if you can be fairly confident that your opponent is on very few or no outs (which is how it turned out) i like how you played it. But if you think that it's pretty likely he's on K-10 or queens, you should move in on the turn. (assuming you think there is a good chance he'll lay down queens). I'm still not sure why you were so confident he was bluffing..

Jester999 · #9 03-25-2005, 01:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I do think folding the turn is correct against most opponents. Problem is, you might not get paid off if you hit.

[/ QUOTE ]

I play lower limits and so on this forum I generally just ask questions. Why not reraise his checkraise on the flop? It seems as if you keep the pressure on him, give yourself chance to get away easier, and also have some fold equity.

But I'm trying to step up my aggressive play, so my suggestion just might be flat out crazy. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Jason Strasser · #10 03-26-2005, 02:59 AM

Because if I reraise his cr then if he decides to call it is almost certain I am drawing. If he was bluffing then he folds. I'd rather he keep bluffing--especially given my draw to the nuts.

-Jason