Party 20/40 Hand

jediael · #1 07-05-2005, 11:01 PM

Villian is semi-tight semi-aggressive and folds his BB to steals about 65% of the time.

Comments on all streets appreciated

Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG raises, 7 folds, Hero calls.

Flop: (4.50 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, UTG 3-bets, Hero caps, UTG calls.

Turn: (6.25 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets, Hero calls.

River: (8.25 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 10.25 BB

sweetjazz · #2 07-05-2005, 11:12 PM

I'm not trying to be a jerk and I'll start by out saying that I haven't played a game above 5/10 in my life. But it looks like you misplayed every single street here. Maybe the 20/40 game is so aggressive that this play works, but you're calling a raise PF when you probably have 3 outs, but don't what they are. You check-raise the flop so that UTG can get away from the hands where is drawing to 3 outs but get in extra bets when he has you drawing to 2 outs. Then you cap the flop OOP when UTG has told you he has jacks up beat. Then you call down anyway.

Because of the aggressiveness of the game as I understand it, I think the call down is less worse than the PF call and the flop check-raise, both of which are absolutely horrible.

I mean, this is horrible play at 2/4. I doubt it suddenly becomes good play at 20/40.

bone77 · #3 07-05-2005, 11:25 PM

If you lead the flop and then get raised, do you 3-bet? Without reads, most opponents will just call the flop 3-bet and then raise with on overpair, or call down with 88-TT, maybe AQ/AK, right? I think this line saves you a BB when you're beat if you can safely lay down to a turn raise.

jediael · #4 07-05-2005, 11:42 PM

You did notice that I am in the big blind? He had about 12% PFR, so the pre-flop call is very very standard and not even close

sweetjazz · #5 07-05-2005, 11:58 PM

I'm slightly more than 12% PFR and my UTG raising standards are roughly 99+, AJ+, KQ, KJs, ATs, and I'll sometimes limp with the weaker hands depending on table conditions.

Against that range, given the discounted price from being in the BB and the fact that you will be out of position the whole hand, I think a call is marginal. If you know the player plays really poorly postflop and have specific exploitable reads, then it becomes a definite call.

If you cap that flop, then I think you lose all of the profitability from calling preflop.

Maybe villain will end up having shown down a horribly played AK or TT. It wouldn't shock me, but you didn't include a read that villain was an idiot in the OP.

jediael · #6 07-06-2005, 12:16 AM

Against your range of hands, I have an equity of about 43% which is more than enough taking into account the fact that in this situation AJo is usually very easy to play from the flop on.

Now I'd rather discuss the best way to play the hand from villans three bet onwards.

I see three main options:
a) cap flop, lead turn
b) call flop 3-bet, bet turn blank
c) call flop 3-bet, check turn, bet any river if he checks behind

I think I prefer b), since it tends to induce weak calls from many hands and also gives me the option to dump my hand if I am raised.

jediael · #7 07-06-2005, 12:18 AM

If I lead and get raised on this board against this opponent, I 3-bet every time and lead the turn if called.
If capped, again I'll have a hard time to play on

sweetjazz · #8 07-06-2005, 12:41 AM

Why not check/call, check/call, bet? This line is good against a non 2+2er, unless they are known to vastly overplay missed hands postflop.

Benjamin · #9 07-06-2005, 10:40 AM

[ QUOTE ]
the fact that in this situation AJo is usually very easy to play from the flop on.

[/ QUOTE ]

You really think so, from out of position, frequently dominated?

I disagree.

When he has you dominated after you improve on the flop it's going to get expensive if you are aggressive.

I think I prefer to take a line more like the check/call, check/call, bet mentioned earlier. Exposing yourself to less downside, and keeping some of his losing hands around longer.

B.

jediael · #10 07-06-2005, 12:54 PM

Agreed, thanks for the input.