Bad Call or bad Read?

[Azrael_AOD]

Ok, I hate when this happens, but it seems to happen all the time.

We're playing $10 no-limit (blinds are 10c/20c). Hero limps UTG with KK. BB raises $1, Hero reraises $2. Folded around to BB, who calls. The pot is now approx. $7.

Flop is K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
BB bets $3, Hero calls on a slowplay. The pot is now $13. Off the bat Hero puts BB on KJs or JJ. He's a pretty tight player and he wouldn't bet into a UTG pf reraiser without a very strong hand (or so I thought).

Turn is T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
BB bets $3 again. Warning bells started going off as soon as I saw the T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] hit, but I ignore it and raise $3 back (going with my initial read). BB immediately goes all-in, and he's got me covered by a decent amount. I call, and he show's down AQs for the nut straight.

River doesn't pair the board so I lose and he takes down a $30 pot.

Any comments? Should I have raised him on the flop? Should I have adjusted my read to account for the possibility of a straight draw?

It was heads up so my tendency is to play a little looser. Should I have folded to the all-in?

I already know how much of a favourite I was to win the hand, so my only query is about the accuracy of my read and whether or not I should have acted on it. FYI the thought of him having the straight only crossed my mind for a split second, but looking back on the way the read crossed my mind I was totally PO'd that I didn't act on it.

Oh, and I broke him before the night was over so I got my revenge. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Haha

[GoSox]

How big was his stack and yours ? I probably would have raised more preflop. Once you see the flop with two high cards and knowing he raised and then called you have to assume it at least partially hit him. Could another card have hurt you ?? Yes of course, so it's not a good situation to slowplay. I would have bet the pot+ on the flop. Given where you ended up on the turn, you still had 10 outs to call and since he could just have easily had two pair or four to a flush I probably would have called with a set. This is one of those hands though where you just somehow know you're going to lose at sight of that reraise.

[styleish]

How much did each of you start with? How much was the all-in push? You still have 10 outs to win and with such a huge pot, you might have the odds to call even if he does have the straight. As for your read..his preflop play looks much more like KJ than JJ. This guy wouldn't half-pot the flop with AK? AQ is a bit odd considering how you described him.

[Azrael_AOD]

I had about $16 in front of me and he had about $25 or so. I called because I thought I might have the right odds- calling approx $7 for a $22 pot. I also called because of my initial read. I know the books say you should call this because you win much more than you lose, but what happens when acting on your read leads to the right move? Should you still pay it off or lay it down and get on with the next hand?

[aLittleFish]

I think you played this hand pretty poorly. I think you're first mistakes were pre-flop. When he raised to a $1, you don't min-raise back. You have the second best hand possible and you want to get more money in pot. You also don't want to give someone with an A odds to see the flop. According to you there was $7 after the preflop betting in the pot. That means he only had to call $1 to see a flop where he could get $6. If you were playing with your hands face up, he'd have pot odds to call you. In my opinion, thats terrible. I also would have played the flop much differently. In my experience when people lead into a raiser on the flop with a significant underbet of the pot, they're hoping for one of two things: first that you'll only call allowing them to draw cheaply or second that you'll raise them. You say you put him on a hand like K-J. If thats what you really thought he had, you had a golden oppurtunity to raise him and try to get all the money in on the flop when you've clearly got the best hand. The raise can't be a min-raise either, go ahead and bet the pot. If he folds, he folds but there's too many hands he could have that he wouldn't want to fold (A-K, A-A, J-J, K-J). If he holds onto his A-Q gutshot draw than there's nothing you can do. It'd be a bad beat, but atleast you'd have gotten your money in when you were ahead. Instead you've put all your money with the worse hand. If you had bet properly from the start, the call on the end would be an easy call. Almost all the money would be in the pot already and if he happened to catch his 11-1 shot risking over half his money to double up, then there's nothing you can do except pay him off.

[styleish]

This is pretty close so the amount of money you have makes a pretty big difference. If you started with 16 then you should have about 4 dollars after he raises all in and it'll be an easy call (you're about 3.7 to 1 to hit). So even if you are absolutely sure he has a straight you would still call. However if you have, as you say, 7 dollars left after his all in then you don't have the odds to call. I think you would still have to be pretty sure he has the straight to fold. There are only 2 hands (aq and q9) that you are behind right now and I don't think he played it like he had either of them. But, of course, I could be wrong. Anybody else?

[amoeba]

I think you played it fine except for not raising more preflop.

Slow playing that rainbow flop with top set is not a problem.More often than not you'll get paid off by somebody holding AK, AA, JJ.

[Azrael_AOD]

The pot was $7 after he called the reraise. He had to put $2 into a approx. $5 pot. So I don't think I made a mistake pf. I could have raised more pf but I thought I'd keep him on a leash. The only mistake I can think of is not raising him on the flop

[aLittleFish]

I misread what you meant a little thinking you made it $2 to go rather than raising it another $2 which makes preflop better but I still think you should have raised there by atleast the pot. As far as keeping him on a leash, I'm not one to slow play many hands, and this hand is an example of why. Often times you're luring someone in who turns around and busts you. You have to keep in mind that when someone is on a flush draw or a straight draw, it doesn't matter if you have top set, top pair, or mid pair. The results are either he catches and wins or misses and loses. Granted a set has redraw value, but its not that much stronger when against a pure draw.

[BobboFitos]

We're playing $10 no-limit (blinds are 10c/20c). Hero limps UTG with KK. BB raises $1, Hero reraises $2. Folded around to BB, who calls. The pot is now approx. $7.

So 15 other people limped in and then folded? I dont understand that!

Also, min raising sucks. When you limp/raise and basically blow your hand, atleast make them pay to see the flop.

Flop is K , J , 4
BB bets $3, Hero calls on a slowplay. The pot is now $13. Off the bat Hero puts BB on KJs or JJ. He's a pretty tight player and he wouldn't bet into a UTG pf reraiser without a very strong hand (or so I thought).

IF YOU PUT HIM ON A STRONG HAND, BUST HIM ON THE FLOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I dont know how many more exclamation points I need to put this across, but move all in, stare at him, call him a BlTCH, and be proud if you're read was dead on as he insta calls with mid set and he's dead to one out. Moving on.

Turn is T
BB bets $3 again. Warning bells started going off as soon as I saw the T hit, but I ignore it and raise $3 back (going with my initial read). BB immediately goes all-in, and he's got me covered by a decent amount. I call, and he show's down AQs for the nut straight.

HAHAHAHA, you deserved that. You really did. You blew the entire hand and paid for it. No sympathy here.



Any comments? Should I have raised him on the flop? Should I have adjusted my read to account for the possibility of a straight draw?

Any comments... Aside from above, basically play this hand everyway different then the way you did would be my answer. Sorry bro. As for your read, apparently he wasn't as strong as you thought he was, so perhaps play situationally a little bit more than instinctually, so to speak.

It was heads up so my tendency is to play a little looser. Should I have folded to the all-in?

You dont tell how much more he moved in for, but you say the pot size is 30, and with the pot about 22 I think? And it's 8 back to you, I dont think it's a fold, especially because you dont *know* he has hit his gutshot to the nuts. (Like... If he did this with pocket fours then you would have just lost a huge EV swing...) So no, I dont really think there's anyway to get away from it at this point for a bet of 8 more $.

I already know how much of a favourite I was to win the hand,

Ummm.. Nope. When the money went in he was a significant favorite over you.

Oh, and I broke him before the night was over so I got my revenge. Haha

Ok, good. All's well that ends well...