Whats your play and how easy a decision is it?

[Punker]

Blinds 75-150, party tourney. You have 1600 or so and are in the big blind and get 98o. Button open limps, SB calls, you check. Flop A76. SB checks.

Do you:

Check with the intent of checkraising a ~pot size bet all in, but folding to a jam?

Bet about the pot yourself?

Jam?

[Exitonly]

how about just checking, with the intention of calling a smallish bet, or getting a free card. Abuot to clear the blinds, will find better places to push and take blinds.

[nath]

What's button's stack size? If he's really large I might push. If he's medium stacked I go for the check-raise all-in. What's the average stack size?

If I had more chips, I would be inclined to lead at it with a bet, depending on what I thought of the button. If I had fewer I would almost always push.

How easy is it? Not particularly, given the number of factors involved, but those are my general ideas.

[Blindcurve]

I lead for 350. I don't really care if I get called, but I'm thinking I won't. If the sb calls, I sincerely hope I hit my straight, because I'm going to need it.

I fold to a push. I'll have ~t1200 left for my imminent double-up attempt.

I fold to a check-raise all-in. I doubt this is coming, though. If the sb had a good ace, I think he'd raise preflop. If he has a smaller ace, he'll be worried about what kicker you're representing. I guess he might check/push with two pair or a set. Doesn't matter, I'm folding anyway. I don't think I need to go broke here.

It seems like a check-raise all-in is a popular play here. I think I'd only consider it if a call and loss for my opponent would leave him crippled. Against two players, the play seems a little reckless. Thus, the choice for a more standard lead is pretty easy for me.

FOITNOF,

-D.

[SoBeDude]

[ QUOTE ]
how about just checking, with the intention of calling a smallish bet, or getting a free card. Abuot to clear the blinds, will find better places to push and take blinds.

[/ QUOTE ]

Quit reading McEvoy's weak-tight books

-Scott

[SoBeDude]

No one has shown strength. Granted the button limp is a bit suspicious, but its usually a very small pair more than aces or even a weak ace. A weak ace on the button usually raises and is happy to win the blinds.

The small blind will mostly bet out with an ace here, so his check is a good sign of weakness.

And you flopped a very nice draw.

Bet out hard, about 2/3 pot sized bet. You're representing an ace here, and if you get called, you have outs.

You don't have a hand yet, so you should be happy to take it down on the flop with a bet. a Check-raise here seems bad to me. You tend to commit too many chips, tying yourself to the pot with nothing but a prayer.

-Scott

[ekky]

[ QUOTE ]
Bet out hard, about 2/3 pot sized bet. You're representing an ace here, and if you get called, you have outs.

[/ QUOTE ]

You think this goes bet/call or bet/fold? I cant see many ways it can go bet/call. If button has an ace, I figure he sticks it in here nearly every single time. I dont see many hands that he would be willing to call with. I think button is in raise/fold territory if Hero leads out.

In this instance, I do like the check-raise. Button figures to not have an ace (given his antics pre-flop), but will feel obliged to take a stab at the pot seeing as the flop is A high and the blinds have checked... and the times he does have an ace.. we have reasonable outs.

My problem with the lead out is that I cant see it getting called too often, and we will probably have to fold to a raise.. so we are almost converting the (reasonable) draw into 2/7 os.

If it gets checked around, thats also no bad thing... so in these circumstances.. Id figure the C/raise is seemingly better then the lead out.

[SoBeDude]

IMO, your line of thinking is all wrong.

remember this. YOU DO NOT HAVE A HAND YET.

So your way, you're committing many many more chips to the pot than I am WITH NO HAND. yea he might lay down, but this is online, he's not dropping an ace after you check-raise (because people make incorrect check-raises like the one you're suggesting).

And as I explained, very rarely is the button going to be limping with an ace. and the SB would have bet out with an ace.

Other hands are going to be afraid of the ace and will either fold or call. And I'm OK with either result. If they both fold, great. I won the pot.

If they call, I have outs to improve. (didn't I mention all this already? I feel like I'm repeating myself)

If they raise, its a simple matter of math on the call/fold decision. This is the easiest decision to make. And don't forget about implied odds here too.

And what 'antics' are you referring to preflop? his LIMP is now an antic?

-Scott

[Kurn, son of Mogh]

Bet 200. If they'll fold for 350, they'll almost always fold for 200.

[ekky]

[ QUOTE ]
So your way, you're committing many many more chips to the pot than I am WITH NO HAND. yea he might lay down, but this is online, he's not dropping an ace after you check-raise (because people make incorrect check-raises like the one you're suggesting).

[/ QUOTE ]

incorrect? its a beautiful thing to be correct all the time. The whole point is that he is unlikely to have an ace, but he will likely bet the flop if its checked around. The raise gets him to fold his non-ace almost every time.Also lets not forget, it isn't no hand no draw... you can still win (quite often as well) if your check/raise gets called! fancy that.

[ QUOTE ]
If they call, I have outs to improve. (didn't I mention all this already? I feel like I'm repeating myself)

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes you did mention this already, and my assertion is that the button is not in a call/fold situation. If he has the Ace, he raises, if he doesn't.. he most likely folds. I feel like I am repeating myself.(now where have I heard that rediculous line before..)


[ QUOTE ]
IMO, your line of thinking is all wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

IMO, your line is wrong as well, but I wont write a post telling you that your thinking is incorrect. I think its called having a polite exchange of views.


[ QUOTE ]
If they raise, its a simple matter of math on the call/fold decision. This is the easiest decision to make. And don't forget about implied odds here too.

[/ QUOTE ]

you seem to be in a hurry to turn this little draw into 2/7 os.. which really is counter-intuitive.

I apologise profusely for having an opinion that differs from yours Sir.