QQ hand - Played too weak?

synthtrance · #1 08-20-2005, 07:17 PM

MP3 just sat down...
Not much of a read on BB other then my gut feeling that he's a fish.

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (6 max, 10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. MP3 posts a blind of $3.
UTG calls, 3 folds, Hero raises, MP3 (poster) calls, 1 fold, Button calls, 1 fold, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (10.33 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, MP3 calls, Button folds, BB calls, UTG folds.

Turn: (6.66 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, Hero checks, MP3 bets, BB calls, Hero folds.

River: (8.66 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, MP3 checks.

Final Pot: 8.66 BB

I would have bet the turn but it would be tough to call a raise and I didn't know if they could bluff like that.
If BB had folded, I think I would have called.

What's your line?

Nick C · #2 08-20-2005, 07:53 PM

I would bet the turn.

The turn card is far from my first choice, but getting called on the flop in two places doesn't mean someone has a 7. BB may have just made a pair of fours, for instance. MP3 could have been peeling with overs or could be on a flush draw. He could also have a hand like K5.

Getting raised here wouldn't be much fun, I'll admit, and I'd fold to a checkraise from BB, based on your vague read (and it's especially not looking good if he checkraises after MP calls). However, versus an MP3 raise, I don't think a fold is so automatic, especially if BB then folds. The possibility that even if I'm behind (and I probably am, once raised) the raise is just two pair and I have 12 outs (8 outs to a set or better two pair and 8 outs to a chop) makes me want to stay in. MP3 could even be raising just a pair with K5 or something, or he could be semi-bluffing a draw. He's not worried you have a straight, and he might think he can get you to fold a better hand or even just push you off of your overs.

I know the board is scary, and a lot of players wouldn't raise two pair or a weak made hand in this spot. But we don't know anything about MP3, and people do show up at the table sometimes and establish their presence by trying to run it over.

Harv72b · #3 08-20-2005, 08:03 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would have bet the turn but it would be tough to call a raise and I didn't know if they could bluff like that.
If BB had folded, I think I would have called.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't understand your thinking here. It's easier to check/fold than bet/fold?

Bet the turn 100% of the time. If you're raised by a non-maniac, then it's a pretty safe fold...especially if the third player calls 2 cold or 3-bets (a little less so if he coldcalls here, with a flush draw out there & your semiread on him as a fish).

ArturiusX · #4 08-20-2005, 08:35 PM

Bet/fold the turn.

#5 08-20-2005, 08:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Bet/fold the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Lozing

W. Deranged · #6 08-20-2005, 09:19 PM

Everyone here nailed it.

Bet the turn. Checking the turn is basically conceding someone a straight before anyone has even expressed that they have it.

This is what is termed weak play.

There's no reason to believe you don't have the best hand. 7's and 2's don't get played all that often. You simply cannot give up on hands this easily or you will get walked all over.

Also, folding to a raise is easy here; on an obvious 4-straight board, except from an extremely adept player, a raise really can only mean one thing.