Checking and Calling my way to millions

[Schneids]

6 handed $150/300.

Raise! opens UTG+1 (henceforth referred to as R! to prevent confusion). R! is pretty solid, TAG, good hand reader blah blah.

I 3bet from the SB with AcTc. R! calls.

Flop [ Qs 8h Ah ]. I bet, he calls.

Turn [ Ks ]. I check, he bets, I call.

River [ 6s ]. I check, he bets, I call.

[NLSoldier]

After taking this line up till the river I am always afraid that they are going to check through so I donk it and usually get raised and always lose so maybe thers something to be said for just check calling. Is he value betting KJ/KT?

[TStoneMBD]

i like the turn checkcall and i agree with not donking the river, thats just silly but i think a checkfold could be considered, no?

[imitation]

Isn't the pot big enough for him to call the flop with gutshots, so can't we fairly easily bet the turn again call a raise and fold on the riveR? Doesn't his flop call say I have a hand that deserves a peel way more than it says I have better than TP

[spydog]

He has to put you on a big Ace or PP after your preflop 3-bet. He knows he can't bluff you out of an Ace on this river and that you would have folded (or would fold) a PP on the turn/river. If he sees your turn check-call as a picked up flush draw then he knows his hand is no good. Basically, it seems that Raise! has no reason to bet this river unless he's fairly strong.

I think it's a check-fold.

[TMFS9]

[ QUOTE ]
He has to put you on a big Ace or PP after your preflop 3-bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure of the history between the players and how the game is playing but I'm pretty sure you can make the assumption that this is too narrow of a range of hands to put schneids on solely because he 3 bet out of the sb.

[spydog]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He has to put you on a big Ace or PP after your preflop 3-bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure of the history between the players and how the game is playing but I'm pretty sure you can make the assumption that this is too narrow of a range of hands to put schneids on solely because he 3 bet out of the sb.

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe. But his raise is coming from UTG+1 (or MP as some like to say), so his raise is more legitimate than a CO/Button raise and thus Schneids has to limit his 3-bet range. If villian's raise came from CO/Button then the hand plays much differently, IMO.

[TStoneMBD]

when schneids checkcalls the turn the only hands he could really have at this point are

Ax
JJ/TT
and maybe KJs.

the opponent certainly cant expect schneids to fold Ax on this river and its extremely unlikely that the opponent cant beat JJ or TT on this board after making it all the way to the river so theres no reason to bluff against those hands. The only hand he'd be value betting against is KJs when he has a weak ace.

basically what im saying is that i think R! should be checking this river with Ax and isn't likely to be holding a hand that loses to TT or JJ so he should be checking down hands that lose to AT.

[stripsqueez]

you turn bet didnt get raised so this looks like following through with the plan to me - folding the river with top pair not no kicker isnt going to happen unless i know something a lot better than i'm not a favourite to win

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[Wynton]

It seems like you need to have some history with villain to make this a good move. I know you have a read on him, but did you really have enough of a read to know that he wouldn't call down with a worse pair or might even raise with a worse hand? And had villain ever seen you take such a passive line before?

Would you consider taking this line against someone who had never seen you stop