MUST BE A STUPID QUESTION

papilindo · #1 10-09-2005, 12:40 AM

I posted this question in general forum and got not responses all day. Anyone care to assist?

IMPLIED ODDS QUESTION...
How do I calculate them in NL? I recently switched from LHE where it was a simple calculation to arrive at w/ some variance due to potential 2 and 3 betting etc. I'm thinking it's not even possible in NL due to potential all-in's. I could really use some help on this as it's screwing with my head a little. thanx in advance

BlackRain · #2 10-09-2005, 01:08 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I posted this question in general forum and got not responses all day. Anyone care to assist?

IMPLIED ODDS QUESTION...
How do I calculate them in NL? I recently switched from LHE where it was a simple calculation to arrive at w/ some variance due to potential 2 and 3 betting etc. I'm thinking it's not even possible in NL due to potential all-in's. I could really use some help on this as it's screwing with my head a little. thanx in advance

[/ QUOTE ]

First off, I am a longtime LHE player as well just coming back to NL. That said, I think it is a question of stack size #1. I don't see any point calling 4xBB with 66 against a guy with 10BB. Against a 100BB I call everytime. Secondly, I think it is a consideration of how disciplined the player is. Will he hand you his whole stack with AA? Or is he capable of a fold on the turn to a checkraise. I don't think there is any precise way to calculate an implied odds # for any specific player but by looking at stack sizes and general tendencies of the player you can determine if it makes sense to call with a low pair PF, or chase a gutshot or flush or whatever.

papilindo · #3 10-09-2005, 01:23 AM

thanx black, this is what i was looking for. so it is much more of a subjective analysis using the elements u described than a simple mathematical calculation as in LHE? still there must be some way to more accurately quantify calling certain hands, like PP against moderate bets/raises, no?

#4 10-10-2005, 12:05 AM

At the moment, I cannot think of any way to describe the calculation of implied odds as anything other than artwork in NL. But here goes.

First, assume your opponent has a decent, weaker hand, but one that s/he thinks may win or may lose. Also, assume s/he is competent. Now, you'll be bluffing % times, usually 10% - 20%. Also, your opponent thinks s/he can win % of the remainder of the time. without calculation, in these circumstances, I'd say a bet of ~1/3 the pot will always be at least called. Put that in your implied odds.

Anything else depends on what you think your opponent has, and how your opponent views you, and how well hidden your hand is. So, I think the rest from here is all subjective. At least, while it may be calculable, it is likely too difficult to do on the spot for most players. I always end up going by intuition based on my hand, whether I played it non standardly, my opponents tendencies, and whether they are better or worse than I.

#5 10-10-2005, 06:02 PM

It really is a good question.

I've found in a game like NLHE online (where you don't know the players and can't get any tells) I usually consider my opponents stack size when i figure the implied odds i'm getting mid to low pp. This assumes that you can always cover your opponent or at least have the max or close buyin in chips. since you'e 7.5 to 1 against making your set on the flop, I usually won't call a significant preflop raise headup unless the opponents stack is at least 8 times the size of the total preflop bet. Even then, I will rarely call a large (5x or more BB) bet preflop if i'm headup and out of position.