Middle Set, Lots of Limpers

jrm · #1 10-24-2004, 04:37 PM

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (8 handed)

UTG+1 (t295)
MP1 (t2060)
MP2 (t470)
CO (t640)
Button (t525)
SB (t780)
Hero (t980)
UTG (Villain) (t2250)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG (Villain) calls t30, UTG+1 calls t30, MP1 calls t30, MP2 folds, CO calls t30, Button calls t30, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (t210) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, Hero bets t210, Villain raises to t950, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls t950, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, Hero ??

How do you play this flop? Was leading with the pot-sized bet correct with so many players acting after me?

Is set over set a possibility here?

Relevant reads:
MP1 built up a big stack on the first hand by bluffing all-in and catching runner-runner to take out 2 players. Since then, MP1 has been pretty loose-passive

Villain has been one of the strangest players I've ever seen. He sat out all of level 1. After returning, he called a river bet while playing the board. Then he bluffed a pot and intentionally showed his cards. The very next hand, he took a pot with a set, playing virtually identically against the same opponent he had bluffed before. Overall, he seemed like a weak player that was trying to be tricky.

lastchance · #2 10-24-2004, 04:42 PM

All-in. Don't see any other way to play it. I would have tried to check-raise here, but other than that, you can't lay down middle set.

Hydro · #3 10-24-2004, 05:31 PM

You think a 1010 would limp for 30? I doubt it.

Going with that idea I would say you have the probably the best hand currently. Now for the raiser, try to put them on hands.

I think someone atleast has a flush draw and the other AT, or JT and similar.

Edit: One more possible hand ofcourse is the 33, which is very possible here, again thats good for you.

This is a no decision, push all in

You definatly should push, even if you are facing a flush draw you still are favoured and pot odds are in your favour.

jrm · #4 10-24-2004, 06:28 PM

I wasn't too worried about Villain. I figured he had AT, two pair (yes, I do think he was capable of playing T3), or a flush draw, with a small chance of having 33 or TT.

At the time, I didn't worry too much about MP1 either, thinking that set over set doesn't happen too much. The more I think about it, though, the more I feel MP1 could have easily had TT. Limping with TT is no big deal if you're playing it for set value. If I were MP1, there is no way I would cold-call a pot-sized bet and a huge raise for half my stack with anything less than a set (without a great read). That means 33 or TT. If I did have TT, I would probably just call, figuring that I had someone that was more than willing to do the betting for me, so I shouldn't have any problems getting all my chips in on the turn.

Perhaps I'm giving MP1 too much credit now, and pushing is still +EV. I'm just wondering if I'll see top set often enough to make folding the right move.

lastchance · #5 10-24-2004, 06:53 PM

You're not going to see top set that often. He could be limping with all sorts of junk. You might have given him implied odds with 43... People suck way too much for you to fold top set. If he calls with 33 as well as TT, you STILL have enough to call here since you're getting 2 to 1. Gotta move in.

NotMitch · #6 10-24-2004, 07:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Perhaps I'm giving MP1 too much credit now, and pushing is still +EV. I'm just wondering if I'll see top set often enough to make folding the right move.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you ever fold here quit poker forever.

jrm · #7 10-24-2004, 07:17 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If you ever fold here quit poker forever.

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't worry, I didn't fold. I just wanted to make sure I was making the right play.

In case you were wondering what happened, Villain turned over AA and MP1 showed JJ. Definitely not what I was expecting to see, but obviously I made the right call this time.

TransientR · #8 10-24-2004, 07:18 PM

Push all in. I know where your coming from re. set of tens, but I find that one of my playing flaws is overestimating the possible hands of my opponents in this situation. If you push all in and get beat, it isn't like you didn't have a hand that deserved that degree of aggression.

Frank