JJ out of position vs LAG (100NL 6max)

jhall23 · #1 06-16-2005, 04:50 PM

Was just going through some hands cause I am bored and to tired to work. I vaguely remember this hand. Read was pretty much just typical 6max lag who played too many pots (like 60%) but isn't a maniac, pfr is only like 8-9.

This standard for you here? What about if villian has same size stack as us?

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 5 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

BB ($156.55)
Hero ($134.15)
MP ($132.53)
Button ($61.87)
SB ($223.6)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $0.5.
Hero raises to $4, 1 fold, Button calls $4, 2 folds.

Flop: ($9.50) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $6.5, Button calls $6.50.

Turn: ($22.50) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets $15, Hero bets $123.65 (All-In).

gulebjorn · #2 06-16-2005, 05:02 PM

First of all, I stopped playing shorthanded because, well, I lose... so feel free to ignore this. I should be studying and don't feel like it, so I'll reply anyway.

PF looks good.

Flop: make it pot size? Any A,3,4,6,7,8 or diamond on the next card completes a flush/straight draw (some more likely than others).

Turn: I'd bet 1/2 - 3/4 of pot here. If he comes over the top, you can fold. Now you check, and he bets. You have no idea if he has the five, a heart draw, a straight draw, a 9, or if he's just bluffing. So you're pretty much pushing a 125$ stack into a 37$ pot here, while you can't be all that sure your hand is good. I think you'll only get a call from a 5, 99 or 22 here.
Edit: a big pair that is letting you hang yourself might also call, but I don't think a hand that you have beat will.

But like I said, I suck at 6-max, so ignore, correct or flame away please.

djoyce003 · #3 06-16-2005, 05:29 PM

well your big checkraise isn't really that big because he only has about $30 left I think, so you are basically raising the size of the pot. I think with his stack size being much less than yours this line of play is ok to get the money in here. If this guy is the typical donk he's calling with a pair of nines, or a draw. If the stack sizes were larger this sort of overbet would be flawed in that the only hands that call you, also beat you, but then again, you might have played it differently against a deeper stack.

gulebjorn · #4 06-16-2005, 05:34 PM

[ QUOTE ]
well your big checkraise isn't really that big because he only has about $30 left I think

[/ QUOTE ]
Damnit, why do I always miss that? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

nietzreznor · #5 06-16-2005, 05:50 PM

I like your line here. Your flop bet + turn checkraise gets more money when he has nothing and is trying to blow you off a whiffed AK, and you probably will also get called by a fair amount of hands that you have beat.

jhall23 · #6 06-16-2005, 07:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
well your big checkraise isn't really that big because he only has about $30 left I think, so you are basically raising the size of the pot. I think with his stack size being much less than yours this line of play is ok to get the money in here. If this guy is the typical donk he's calling with a pair of nines, or a draw. If the stack sizes were larger this sort of overbet would be flawed in that the only hands that call you, also beat you, but then again, you might have played it differently against a deeper stack.

[/ QUOTE ]

Definetly would have played differently if villian was as deep as I was (barring some sort of supreme donk read). Probably leading the turn for 15 ish. I'm interested in what size stack people think villian has to have when this move starts to suck.

jhall23 · #7 06-16-2005, 07:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Flop: make it pot size? Any A,3,4,6,7,8 or diamond on the next card completes a flush/straight draw (some more likely than others).

[/ QUOTE ]

Heads up this is pretty much my standard bet with this type of board until I get a read that villian calls to much. It's pretty much a style thing cause I am raising a ton pre-flop and following up often. That way it's cheaper when I get looked up when I have nothing and make a continuation bet. I'm more likely to pot it if it's 3 way. Not saying that is necessarily the best plan, just want to lay out my reasoning for you.

jhall23 · #8 06-17-2005, 12:35 PM

This probably isn't really that interesting of a hand so I'll just post results.

Button called the check raise so quickly I thought I was screwed. Turns out that wasn't needed as he had 78h for flush draw plus gutshot. No help for him on the river.

Still interested on what size stack others feel the LAG villian needs to make the turn c/r all in a bad move.