Another 200/400 bellagio hand vs terri

[mikelow]

Agree. A set is a real possibility. I'll donk a call on the river.

[DpR]

I would call and lead the river. I am definitely not folding your hand at any point and I dont think you are winning enough if 3 more big bets go in.

1-2 more BBs seems comfortable and appropriate.

[worm33]

I would assume you are pretty sure you have the best hand, are you trying to figure out how to get that extra bet? You think she folds 53 or 10-3 if u 5 bet? Even if she would she has odds to draw to the 4 outer with 53 after u 5 bet. I would 5 bet.

[DpR]

I think BK has thebest hand here close to 50% of the time.

Bottom line is that I most certainly do not want to put in 7 BB on the two streets, nor do I ever want to fold. If BK 5 bets, he can be put in the position to do one of the two options above. If BK calls and leads, only 6 bets can go in max, and he definitely gets 6.

[Lestat]

If he calls and leads (not a terrible play), shouldn't he 3-bet the river given what took place in the KJ hand?

I know what you mean about gaining and losing what a hand seems worth. But because of the KJ hand, BK is in an excellent position to make a little extra, don't you think?

[roy_miami]

[ QUOTE ]
I know what you mean about gaining and losing what a hand seems worth. But because of the KJ hand, BK is in an excellent position to make a little extra, don't you think?

[/ QUOTE ]

She knows that BK had KJ that hand so that should help BK get a little extra with top 2.

BK knows she knows BK had KJ that hand so that also should help BK push harder here with top 2 and make a little extra.

BUT, she knows BK knows she knows he had KJ that hand so when BK 3-bets this hand she should assume he's not getting out of line again.

AND, BK knows she knows BK knows she knows he had KJ that hand and BK knows she should assume he's not getting over aggressive with top pair again so BK needs to play a little more carefully here.

I'm not sure where top 2 fits into all of this but I think its close either way between calling and raising.

[DpR]

[ QUOTE ]
If he calls and leads (not a terrible play), shouldn't he 3-bet the river given what took place in the KJ hand?

I know what you mean about gaining and losing what a hand seems worth. But because of the KJ hand, BK is in an excellent position to make a little extra, don't you think?

[/ QUOTE ]

I hadnt read the KJ hand prior to posting in this one (Was away all weekend and catching up on posts today). Given that hand I do not dislike 5-betting as much as BK is ahead more than I thought. I would really have to be in the game to know if a river bet/3-bet was not psychotic. Certainly would be pretty sweet though :-) That said, seems a little 'over tricky', and putting 4 bets in on both big streets here would make me feel pretty dumb (especially against a non-lagtard)

[J.A.Sucker]

You could 5 bet here, but I would just call it down. It's close. A set is a very likely hand at this point. If you think she's messing with you, then 5 bet. I'd move seats, too.

FWIW, for those saying that "there's no way she wouldn't raise 33 or 55 preflop" I think you're on crack. There's no way she would raise those hands.

[DcifrThs]

[ QUOTE ]
You could 5 bet here, but I would just call it down. It's close. A set is a very likely hand at this point. If you think she's messing with you, then 5 bet. I'd move seats, too.

FWIW, for those saying that "there's no way she wouldn't raise 33 or 55 preflop" I think you're on crack. There's no way she would raise those hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

in my initial responses i missed the part about the gambler limping in the CO and thought she had position and BK just completed. thats why i thought a) top two is disguised (bk normally JTs is a raise from bk folded to the sb) and b) terri would raise those pairs preflop.

given the other player in the pot its way way closer and probably indeed leaning towards a call...but you really have to consider that insta 3bet w/ KJno spade on J83Xsssx (or whatever) board on the turn that they both know they both know. as a result, i think a worse two plair hand is definately possible putting in that 4th bet. the problem is if you are 6 bet it is so amazingly likely you are beat its not funny.

without any previous hand discussion/reads definately a call...but given the discussion bka nd terri have had id still lean a bit towards a raise b/c at that point, even bottom set gets a bit worried and isn't likely to 6bet.

the questions i have are then does she ever fold after putting in 5 bets? (assuming no) and after putting in 5 bets, getting called on the river isn't the greatest thing in the world so an inconsistent check may be worth it...which then kinda leans toward a turn call.

the fact they talk makes this hand very close imo.

Barron

[skp]

Call.

All these bets and raise form a dialogue and her 4th bet certainly shouts out 33 or 55 more than J5 or J3 (which BTW are hands with which she may have raised you on the flop with and she didn't here which further indiactes a set).

Ya, you might look a little silly if you call and the river goes check check but that's the power of position. If you really wanted to, you could call the turn and then betcall the river. That's still 6 bets turn and river combined.