Line Check - 99 in the SB

#1 12-22-2005, 11:04 AM

I had no read on the initial raiser, but would classify the BB as somewhat tight. I had a fairly TAG image. I'd like to get thoughts on both pre-flop (calling vs. raising) and my turn decision. Thanks.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t400 (9 handed) internettexasholdem.com

MP1 (t8425)
MP2 (t4272)
MP3 (t21411)
CO (t14388)
Button (t13324)
Hero (t27249)
BB (t15805)
UTG (t9945)
UTG+1 (t11056)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 9:club:, 9:heart:.
[color:#666666]2 folds[/color], [color:#CC3333]MP1 raises to t800[/color], [color:#666666]4 folds[/color], Hero calls t600, BB calls t400.

Flop: (t2000) 4:heart:, 5:diamond:, 4:club: [color:#0000FF](3 players)[/color]
[color:#CC3333]Hero bets t2400[/color], BB calls t2400, MP1 folds.

Turn: (t6800) 8:heart: [color:#0000FF](2 players)[/color]
[color:#CC3333]Hero bets t13200[/color], BB calls t12580 (All-In).

River: (t32580) 7:spade: [color:#0000FF](2 players, 1 all-in)[/color]

Final Pot: t32580

A_PLUS · #2 12-22-2005, 11:17 AM

You forgot to change the format on the converter to 2+2

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t400 (9 handed) converter

MP1 (t8425)
MP2 (t4272)
MP3 (t21411)
CO (t14388)
Button (t13324)
Hero (t27249)
BB (t15805)
UTG (t9945)
UTG+1 (t11056)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 raises to t800, 4 folds, Hero calls t600, BB calls t400.

Flop: (t2000) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets t2400, BB calls t2400, MP1 folds.

Turn: (t6800) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets t13200, BB calls t12580 (All-In).

River: (t32580) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: t32580

A_PLUS · #3 12-22-2005, 11:31 AM

I wasted my F*@$ing Poo Bah post fixing your mess!!!!!

I dont really know what you are going to accomplish with a 2x pot bet on the turn. You arent going to get many OC hands to call, and most of the lower PPs that would call have made a set. I dont think you should lose the lead here, but the overbet makes it too easy for 66, 77, AK to get away, and TT+ arent going anywhere anyway.

mlagoo · #4 12-22-2005, 11:35 AM

i dont really get it.

you overbet the flop for some reason on a very non-threatening board with only a very specific couple hands that you could be forcing to draw incorrectly.

then you hugely overbet the turn when the only hands that are calling you are an overpair, a 4, a FH, or a straight.

im not sure what to say here. dont play it this way.

first off, you could fold preflop. but you guys are probably deep enough that calling here is ok.

secondly, you need to bear in mind that you are first to act on every street. so slow down.

on the flop, why did you bet so much? we talk a lot on this board about not playing big pots out of position. when you bet the flop like that, it's the classic "win a small pot or lose a big one" line.

instead, fire out a bet of something like 2/3 pot. you have a strong hand, but MP1 raised with something, and you'd like to have a better idea of what before you go blindly firing chips into the pot.

on the turn, i like a check. there's just no reason to blindly stick all your chips in without even thinking of what BB might have called you with on the flop here. the only hands that you're beating on the turn that he might POSSIBLY call with here are A5, 66, 77. That is an incredibly small hand range, and doesn't pay you off enough to justify going broke against the hands that are beating you on the turn (any overpair, 55, 88, 67, A4).

i think if you check the turn, one of a few things can happen: (1) if villian's bet size/timing convinces you that you have him beat, you can call and see a river. there's no draw here that you are "letting off for cheap"; (2) villian will check it through sometimes, allowing you to check/call the river for relatively cheap; or (3) villian will bet, you will decide you are beat and fold. the good thing about (3) is there just aren't enough hands he called with on the flop that are bluffing you off of the best hand here on the turn -- villian didn't call with AK on the flop.

anyway, this post kinda got out of control. just slow down.

Matador225 · #5 12-22-2005, 11:37 AM

Preflop I think you played it fine. Calling is the best option here because if you reraise and MP1 pushes you really can't call.

I think you start to get into trouble on the flop. No need to bet more than the pot when initial raiser probably has overs. The flat call by the BB should have you worried, but you could still very well have the best hand.

Your push on the turn is pretty bad IMO. Your not getting called by many worse hands (maybe a few lower pocket pairs) and its doubtful that you can get a better hand to lay it down. I think most times I would check/call the turn here and reevaluate on the river, probably calling a reasonable bet.

Because the BB got in for cheap with good odds, I think you will certainly see trip 4s once in awhile. Something like A4s or 55 is definitely possible, even if the BB is tight.

I think this hand is a good example of one where you want to keep the pot small. If you had raised the flop less and taken an alternate line on the turn, you definitely could have left yourself some chips if you ended up losing.

#6 12-22-2005, 12:07 PM

Thanks, your thoughts are basically how I thought about the hand after the fact. After the flop, I bet the pot thinking I would win it here if both players had just over cards. After the turn, I made a rash decision, thinking if I made him play for all his chips, only 55, and hand with a 4, and 88 were calling. As Chevy Chase says in Dirty Work, "hindsight's 20/20". For whatever reason, TT-AA never popped into my mind, as I though he would re-raise on the flop with those hands.

I definitely play over pairs too fast, and need to adjust that part of my game.