HELP - I keep getting killed with AA

[Dov]

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Hero's hand is strong, but vulnerable, and he needs to find out where he's at in a hurry, unless he's cool with being stacked w/ aces every time he's behind with them.

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This is the heart of the problem for me. I am definitely NOT COOL with getting stacked holding aces.

It's been happening too much lately and I need to find out why.

[imported_anacardo]

A bad stretch of luck, mostly, in all likelihood. If a lot of those scenarios are similar to this one, you should make sure you bet the flop stronger. I personally like to pot somewhat coordinated boards like this one whether I'm holding a strong top pair, overpair, or a strong draw, to obscure reads and make for tougher decisions. I however have a very aggressive style that creates its own set of problems, so this may not be for everybody.

Calling a push postflop with aces or kings in the pocket can be a very tough decision, especially in the case of a board that's coordinated, but not too coordinated, like this one. It's very important to have some idea of your man's tendencies so you can narrow his range of hands; the looser & more aggressive, the more you should be inclined to pay him off. With no strong reads... well, you're really gonna have to go with what's in your gut. Given the size of the pot here I'd say you really can't lay down the river, but on my A game, I can see folding to the turn miniraise.

[Dov]

Thanks for the reply.

I find that my best game comes out when I play aggressively as well.

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I personally like to pot somewhat coordinated boards like this one whether I'm holding a strong top pair, overpair, or a strong draw, to obscure reads and make for tougher decisions.

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I used to do this, and it worked quite well, until I read Harrington. Maybe I misunderstood, but I think he was saying that you can accomplish the same thing with a 3/4 size bet.

He may be referring to tournaments though. I guess I have to go reread it.

He was saying that pot sized bets are too big because you want callers.

[imported_anacardo]

It's sort of a metagame idea of mine, I guess. At the limits & tables I play, I see people routinely pot/overpot their strong pairs versus flush draws; I like to represent the same action with a wider range of hands. I like to encourage steamrollers & gambool types to take a shot at me by suggesting that I'm trying to kill the action because I don't want callers. Often I'll be holding a set or a powerful combo draw here, and if I'm played back at, I'm often gonna get my money in the middle and put them to some serious thought.

[Dov]

Thanks.

This is kind of like what I was trying to suggest to soah in the other thread.

You said it much better though. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[Dov]

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Was it at least sooooted?

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Now that you mention it, NO.

Thanks for the salt. [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

[SirArthur]

What's with the uber weak, P/F raise? You may as well limp with them if you're going for deception, as a 3X the BB raise will allow all types of hands in with you.

As it was, you want to bet more on that draw heavy flop, especially with two others in the hand with you.

[Dov]

I was kind of in tournament mode when I made the PF raise.

As soon as I clicked it, I knew it was weak.

Regarding the flop, I had read in Harrington that a 3/4 bet would generally accomplish the same thing as a pot bet with a 25% discount.

As I noted elsewhere in the thread, I think I misunderstood it and am going to reread it now.

Thanks for helping. I appreciate it.

[Logik]

By only raising 3x BB you are inviting other hands in. You want to jack it up to at least 5x BB on this table, as they seem pretty loose. If they'll call a 3x BB raise with K5o, then you can juice them more when you pick up a big hand because they'll probably call a 5x BB raise with a similar trash hand.

[FreakDaddy]

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I don't think there's anyway I fold this river getting 3.4-1.

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I was more worried about the earlier streets, I guess.

In retrospect, I think I should have made it 5 or so PF and maybe pushed on the turn.

Is the way I actually played it better than this line?

Does anyone else release this on the turn?

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You should have made it at least 4 to go pre-flop. Most people at this level will play crap hands when someone raises 3x BB pre-flop from MP, ESPECIALLY at 6 max. From EP, maybe you get away with it, but still unlikely in online play 6 max.

On the flop you HAVE to at least pot size this with the flush draw out there. People at 6-max will call with all sorts of crazy hands. And with a 3x BB raise pre-flop, you're not going to get a lot of respect. People will call you down with bottom pair. Besides, if someone has Kx, you're going to get lots of action. If not, then it's not meant to be and be happy that you took down the small pot. Don't get greedy with your aces. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

The rest is.. well... not good.