Seeing the flop for one bet.

[Siegmund]

A proposition:

"On all hands where the pot is unraised before the flop, at least one of the limpers/checkers has made a mistake."

True or false, in your opinion?

You may interpret the word "mistake" however you'd like (general usage, FTOP sense, or whatever else the word means to you) but if you feel your answer might be different if you used a different defintion, please give me a clue how you meant it.

[Toddster18]

[ QUOTE ]
A proposition:

"On all hands where the pot is unraised before the flop, at least one of the limpers/checkers has made a mistake."

True or false, in your opinion?

You may interpret the word "mistake" however you'd like (general usage, FTOP sense, or whatever else the word means to you) but if you feel your answer might be different if you used a different defintion, please give me a clue how you meant it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Equity wise, yes. Unless there is a pot where only two players are involved and they somehow are exactly 50/50 on equity, the player who has the most equity "should" have raised.

Alternatively, this is not always correct. Perhaps its folded to a player on the button with AA who knows the uberlag in the SB will go nuts without a hand against a button limper but that both blinds will fold to a raise. In this situation it's probably correct to simply call.

So, I say... as is (most) always the case... "it depends". [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

-Todd

[AaronBrown]

I think it's theoretically possible that no one made a mistake. The first player to check obviously could have a checking hand. One check makes the next player more likely to raise or fold, because he knows he's playing against a checking hand. But there are still hands too speculative to raise, but too good to fold.

Each subsequent player needs an even more perfect checking hand. If I think I'm playing against several guys with suited connectors, I'll raise on any high cards or pair, and fold almost any flush or straight possibility. But if I have suited J 10, I can't raise except as a pure bluff, but I like my chances with a good flop.

If the first guy to check could do it again, knowing that he was checked, he would probably raise or fold. But based on what he knew at the time, he could have done the right thing.