Laying AK Down Preflop

[adanthar]

This is a push or fold - calling is terrible - because a decent player is not generally doing that with AQ and even if he is you will be blown off any flop you both miss.

I don't mind either of those. (Of course, this assumes he's decent.)

[AcesKracked]

I agree w/ Dave D - I think at this point, especially in a $20 MTT, you are at worst a coin flip. I want to see a flop and go for the check raise if I hit, or bail if I don't. You have an excellent chance to bust this guy and practically double up if you hit the flop. My 2 cents.
AcesKracked

[dark_horse]

[ QUOTE ]
if you are going to fold that hand, your open raise shouldn't be 3.5x, especially from EP.

I don't mind pushing there.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yuck. I'm not pushing preflop in this spot. I guess you're talking about when the action first gets to me in the hand, not after he reraises me. I can see a case for pushing after he reraises me. I don't like calling either. Push/fold based on read.

[blackaces13]

[ QUOTE ]
This is a push or fold - calling is terrible - because a decent player is not generally doing that with AQ and even if he is you will be blown off any flop you both miss.

I don't mind either of those. (Of course, this assumes he's decent.)

[/ QUOTE ]

This is extremely similar to the situation described in HoH v2 on about page 235, the second example. In that example the book tells you to call and fold the flop if it misses you. Why is calling "terrible"? You're not getting good value on your money by shoving all in if the guy has a pocket pair, which seems to be his most likely holding by far.

[Danny H.]

Darkhorse in your first post you mention no reads...then suddenly in your last you have a read...? Sorry just wondering what it is. Personally I call here b/c I'm getting good odds on my money and I can bust a player. If I do lose then I still have enough chips to make one more good last stand. I guess I'm agreeing with other guy that posted earlier and said call.

[adanthar]

I don't like a lot of things in HoH2 (like a LOT of them) so it's not a particularly good book to bring up, but actually, this hand is far closer to the first example in that book than the second. He's raising to over a third of his stack, and more importantly, calling is a quarter of yours.

Also, what Harrington doesn't say/consider is that when your opponent is a clown doing this with AJ, you don't see an A or K one in three times; you see it around one in four. That wrecks your odds pretty badly even when your implied odds rise to compensate (they don't always).

[dark_horse]

[ QUOTE ]
Darkhorse in your first post you mention no reads...then suddenly in your last you have a read...? Sorry just wondering what it is. Personally I call here b/c I'm getting good odds on my money and I can bust a player. If I do lose then I still have enough chips to make one more good last stand. I guess I'm agreeing with other guy that posted earlier and said call.

[/ QUOTE ]

i guess in the future if i'm getting 2:1 on my money and i have some chips to spare i'm calling planning on only seeing the flop. you are 2.1:1 to flop a pair. i play a very cautious game in the early rounds, especially when i have some chips in front of me. my game shifts into high gear when the antes kick in.

[dark_horse]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like a lot of things in HoH2 (like a LOT of them) so it's not a particularly good book to bring up, but actually, this hand is far closer to the first example in that book than the second. He's raising to over a third of his stack, and more importantly, calling is a quarter of yours.

Also, what Harrington doesn't say/consider is that when your opponent is a clown doing this with AJ, you don't see an A or K one in three times; you see it around one in four. That wrecks your odds pretty badly even when your implied odds rise to compensate (they don't always).

[/ QUOTE ]

that's what i don't like about calling this out of position. if your AK high is best, he can easily take you off the hand unless you have a super read.

[Rizen]

I don't think there is anything wrong with laying this down, but I really dislike your opening raise. I think you should have either raised less (~250) or more (~500). At this stage in the tournament I prefer to make the smaller raise since playing AK post flop with a large pot can be tricky, especially out of position.

and UTG raise then UTG+1 re-raise is pretty strong, so I'd say you have practically no fold equity here. You also have a large stack, and you should be reluctant to get into coin flips with those other people at your table that can nearly bust you. When you have a large stack in relation to the big blind I believe your priority is to protect your big stack, try and pick up uncontested pots to chip up, and tangle with the smaller stacks when the pot odds and your hand dictate it is correct to do so, in that order.

I don't think winning this hand at this stage of the tournament significantly increases your chances of making the final table that much, while losing this potential coin flip virtually assures you won't make it.

Barring reads I either lay this down (easily if I make a smaller PF raise) or call with the plan of check/folding a miss, check raising all in if I hit, and possibly pushing the flop if the board is scary enough and I think I can get him to lay down a hand like TT or JJ.

Call me weak tight, but when I have 50 times the BB I don't like to play coin flips for most of my chips, especially early in the tournament.

-Rizen

[dark_horse]

Agree 100%. Great post. I'll have to remember about the size of my PF raise when I've got AK in EP at this stage in the tournament (will happen rarely).