preflop question

Heimdal · #1 04-26-2005, 03:48 PM

I would really like to post more here but I dont know how to get started.

Here is a hand I played(well it's not really a hand - I didnt see a flop)

2/4NL on PS. One limper. Good, tight and a little passive CO with $450 behind raises to $20. I have JJ in BB and fold (I had him covered).

I thought he had a big pair or AK/AQ. I wouldn't call this with 22, why call with JJ? I wasn't sure if I could get his stack (or just half of it) if i flopped set.

Weak tight? other thoughts?

Jacob_Gilliam · #2 04-26-2005, 03:56 PM

Call.

Its possible that he has Ak or AQ (more likely than AA-QQ), and if the flop comes with babies you can attack him (if he reraises the flop you have to give some consideration to him having an overpair). Also you might flop a set and win a huge pot. You're right not to play a hand like 22 though. Unless you flop a set every card that comes is a scare card and you would always be guessing whether your opponent flopped an overpair.

swolfe · #3 04-26-2005, 03:57 PM

too tight. his raise is less than 5% of your stacks. you have HUGE implied odds to play for set value.

swolfe · #4 04-26-2005, 03:58 PM

i'd call with 22 every time.

thedecline19 · #5 04-26-2005, 03:59 PM

gotta at least call here, see what the flop brings. fold isnt correct as you will get paid if you hit a set pretty heartily if he has a bigger pair. This 5xbb raise shouldnt be enough to get you off JJ preflop. If any overs flop and he plays them hard, easy to get away for relatively cheap. I just dont think you can throw this away for a standard raise when its a pretty easily playable hand in this situation.

You really only get in trouble when the flop hits all unders, but then you just have to decide what he has based upon his bets. You could be decently ahead at that point.

the machine · #6 04-26-2005, 04:03 PM

NEVER FLAT CALL A RAISE WITH JJ. reraise and then put him on a hand if he calls or reraises you. you could be a 4-1 dog, he could be a 4-1 dog to you or it may be a coin flip or a real weak ace 10. never call becuase there are too many scare cards that can hit the flop. very tight to fold but at least you didnt flat call like i see so many other people do with jj, its just horrible.

Jacob_Gilliam · #7 04-26-2005, 04:04 PM

Agree with both the other posters except i still dont play 22. You have no almost no chance of winning if you dont flop a set and you dont know if hes going to pay you off if you flop a set. (If hes steal raising he might give it up on the flop).

Jacob_Gilliam · #8 04-26-2005, 04:07 PM

nope, still call if you're confident you can outplay him on the flop.

swolfe · #9 04-26-2005, 04:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
NEVER FLAT CALL A RAISE WITH JJ. reraise and then put him on a hand if he calls or reraises you. you could be a 4-1 dog, he could be a 4-1 dog to you or it may be a coin flip or a real weak ace 10. never call becuase there are too many scare cards that can hit the flop. very tight to fold but at least you didnt flat call like i see so many other people do with jj, its just horrible.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is generally pretty bad advice. you're going to lose a lot of money by reraising JJ out of position against a tight raiser.

Heimdal · #10 04-26-2005, 04:20 PM

wow quick responses. The raiser is not a bad player (i have seen him play in the 10/20 and he is a winning player in my PT stats). He will not loose his stack with AA on a j73 flop thinking that I probably have AJ (unless he thinks im a morron which i dont think).

Also what difference does it make whether I have 22 or JJ if I put him on AA-QQ?
Perhaps my read was wrong here but that was what I thought he had when he raised.

Im just trying to learn