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  #1  
Old 12-22-2005, 08:54 PM
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Default How strong to play this PF?

PLO$50
Just sat down, no reads.
Seat 1: ( $62.97 )
Seat 2: ( $12.45 )
Seat 4: ( $80.50 )
Seat 5: ( $55.65 )
Seat 3: Hero ( $49.40 )
Seat 6: villian ( $42 )
posts small blind [$0.25].
villian posts big blind [$0.50].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]]
Hero raises to 1.75
villian reraises to $6
Hero?
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  #2  
Old 12-22-2005, 09:20 PM
Tilt Tilt is offline
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Default Re: How strong to play this PF?

Just call
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  #3  
Old 12-22-2005, 09:22 PM
BluffTHIS! BluffTHIS! is offline
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Default Re: How strong to play this PF?

You should just call and play the flop. Unless he is a known LAG, you are usually looking at AA. Even if he isn't a LAG but is the type of player who likes to reraise a raiser with something like JT98, you should still just call and play the flop because your hand can trap him for his stack with the right flop. Only if your stack were so short that you could get allin by a reraise should you consider doing so with KK.
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Old 12-22-2005, 10:54 PM
bholdr bholdr is offline
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Default Re: How strong to play this PF?

[ QUOTE ]
You should just call and play the flop. Unless he is a known LAG, you are usually looking at AA. Even if he isn't a LAG but is the type of player who likes to reraise a raiser with something like JT98, you should still just call and play the flop because your hand can trap him for his stack with the right flop. Only if your stack were so short that you could get allin by a reraise should you consider doing so with KK.

[/ QUOTE ]

i am once again impressed with your analysis, bluffthis, let me expand for my own benifit (may i have your thoughts on my thought process for this spot?)

It would help to know the table's % to the flop, % of raised pots, position of the limpers, etc... do you play in this game a lot? what's your table image? need info!

but... given a standard $50 PLO table...

BT's line is exactly the reasoning/line i would have in this spot; He very likely has one of the two options BT proposed- i'm one of those guys that likes to re-raise a raiser with middle wrapping hands like 89TJ, because they're so good at stacking an AA hand... same goes for your hand- you really want to call and try to make a straight here- which should be WAY ahead of an AA or a wrapper... and just right to take the whole stack...

but if you were to re-pot PF (representing strong aces)... if he has aces, he'll get it all in and will/should fold lower wrap hand. bottom line, imo, is that calling is a "lose-a-little-or-win-a-lot" move here, while re-raising is a "win-a-little-or-lose-a-lot" play, imo.

as for when against a known LAG... (like me), i disagree with BT a little: though they might be trying to buy position/ force out limpers (but he doesn't neet to pot it to do that), or they might think they can buy it... they'll still have aces a big % of the time. You are also out of position, which is a big advantage against a LAG, if you call: time for a C/R if ya hit: god, i love doing that. if you raised again, you're flat out comitted even if you miss, basicly.

so, i still just call vs most LAGs, only re-potting against a mainiac or total gambler.

i also call against TAGs and L/Ps... though i may min-re-raise a W/T player... thoughts on that?
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  #5  
Old 12-23-2005, 07:34 AM
BluffTHIS! BluffTHIS! is offline
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Posts: 375
Default Re: How strong to play this PF?

Regarding the table dynamics, since it is clear this will be a headsup pot with the action, only the read if any of the opponent is pertinent. And reraising with hands like 4 to a straight hands, should only remotely be comtemplated with both players having very deep stacks, the idea being to tie the opponent with AA into the pot while still having lots to win and being able to make a significant raise on the flop, thus keeping him from just being able to set himself in, forcing you to make a hand and also not be able to make any more if you do. Thus you want the possibility of big implied odds to make those moves preflop.

Regarding the LAG, when I said I would sometimes make an exception and put in another raise preflop, I mean if he is a total LAG who is going to chase to the river with anything. In that case with KK and very good sidecards I might reraise so as to be able to either set myself or call myself allin on the flop and just see 5 board cards. However, recognizing that LAGs are most prone to overplay any hand with a suited ace, regardless of the sidecards, then a KK hand with an A for a sidecard would be a much superior hand with which to make this play.

And as far as min-reraising a weak-tight, that would be a horrible mistake. He can only have AA and you don't want to let the pot be so big that he can bet himself allin on the flop. Since he is W/T you can make him lay AA down with the right board that misses his sidecards, even on a near total miss for you as well. So you want to preserve that leverage.
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