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  #1  
Old 10-17-2005, 02:50 PM
jhall23 jhall23 is offline
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Posts: 340
Default A KK hand, I might be rusty (6 max)

Multi-poker. I have a bazillion hands to clear for the re-load and the PLO games are pretty much dead after the split so I am dicking around 4 tabling the 50 6 max tables to see if it is worthwile to clear my bonus.

Overall felt I was playing pretty well, but possibly a little rusty from not having played much hold'em recently.

Here's one I wasn't sure of.

Villian is LAGish. 38/9/2 after 200 hands but that's about all I have.


Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 5 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

saw flop|<font color="#C00000">saw showdown</font>

MP ($116.05)
<font color="#C00000">Button ($42.35)</font>
SB ($31.10)
BB ($72.70)
<font color="#C00000">Hero ($48.75)</font>

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $0.25.
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $2</font>, MP calls $2, Button calls $2, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>.

Flop: ($6.75) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $6</font>, MP folds, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises to $15</font>
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  #2  
Old 10-17-2005, 02:52 PM
scdavis0 scdavis0 is offline
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Default Re: A KK hand, I might be rusty (6 max)

Call and c/r all in on a good looking turn.
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  #3  
Old 10-17-2005, 02:55 PM
jhall23 jhall23 is offline
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Default Re: A KK hand, I might be rusty (6 max)

Don't think I can c/r all in on the turn, see stack sizes.
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  #4  
Old 10-17-2005, 08:34 PM
jhall23 jhall23 is offline
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Default Re: A KK hand, I might be rusty (6 max)

Alright this seems pretty simple but I need to get the rust off my game and make sure I am still thinking about things good in the heat of the moment.

So I put villian on a pretty wide range: set, two-pair, draw (possibly big combo), air, maybe a straight. Couldn't see any value in pushing the flop since a lot of the hands he could have have better equity when seeing two cards and would gladly call and only Air will fold.

What I decided to do was to call and then push on a safe turn. Only problem was that I am not sure what exactly makes a safe turn on this board. Is everyone content to consider any non-heart turn safe and just be willing to pay off if they hit some straight?

Anyway, turn was the Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Check/fold yes?
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  #5  
Old 10-17-2005, 08:41 PM
nrinker nrinker is offline
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Default Re: A KK hand, I might be rusty (6 max)

With the villains hand range, you either need to get it in on the flop or fold when he raised you.

Calling and pushing the turn is horrid. If you call then push the turn, the villain still calls with the better hands you mentioned, but also gets to draw/bluff your ass out if a scare card hits for you.

Calling, then pushing the turn accomplishes nothing.

If the villain has 99-QQ, you may fold them you may not. Im leaning towards not though, if an over card comes on the turn and you push because it is "safe", then you could possibly push villain off the hand he was going to call with on the flop.

This is why you absolutely need to fold or 3bet(large or all in) this flop.
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  #6  
Old 10-17-2005, 11:09 PM
jhall23 jhall23 is offline
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Posts: 340
Default Re: A KK hand, I might be rusty (6 max)

[ QUOTE ]
With the villains hand range, you either need to get it in on the flop or fold when he raised you.

[/ QUOTE ]

We'll not sure exactly on the range, that's just my guess and would like to see if others agree. I am not sure I agree that I must push it in if I decide to play. I did consider a fold on the flop but it irk's me to fold to this almost min-raise crap.

[ QUOTE ]


Calling and pushing the turn is horrid. If you call then push the turn, the villain still calls with the better hands you mentioned, but also gets to draw/bluff your ass out if a scare card hits for you.



[/ QUOTE ]

Of course he still calls with the better hands nothing we can do about that. But if a blank hits it is better to get it in on a safe turn when my equity is much higher. There are many drawing hands that really want to get in on the flop so they can see all the cards. They are often better then a coin-flip, but on the turn then loose a lot of equity if a blank falls. So I risk giving them the free shot to get to the turn but then will not give them a free card on the turn.

One advantage of the push is that it prevent's villian from pushing me off my hand if a scare card hits. But for this we need villian to be bluffing the flop and willing to follow up bluff on the turn. As said I think a bluff is possible on the flop, but do you think he will always bluff on the turn when he has just shy of a pot size bet left? Also I think the bluff on the flop is probably less likely then the other hands in his range.

[ QUOTE ]


Calling, then pushing the turn accomplishes nothing.

If the villain has 99-QQ, you may fold them you may not. Im leaning towards not though, if an over card comes on the turn and you push because it is "safe", then you could possibly push villain off the hand he was going to call with on the flop.



[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree that it accomplishes nothing. If drawing it allows me to get the money in with higher equity as I stated above. Also I don't think 99-QQ calls that often. QQ might call the flop, but I think 99-JJ is probably stretching after raising PF and then 3 betting on the flop.

[ QUOTE ]


This is why you absolutely need to fold or 3bet(large or all in) this flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think absolutely is pushing it here. Maybe a push is correct but I'm not convinced yet.
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