K8s flop question

[chief444]

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Raising the turn is also going to be a FTOP mistake much of the time, whereas raising the flop will not be.

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huh?

[NickRegino]

i call and raise the turn if the card is safe.

[HolyBejeesus]

To clarify, with so many players in the pot, many turn cards that look safe will not be. IE, some LP peels with QJ and hits a J.

[chief444]

Yeah, that's sort of the point of the flop call. You make it sound as if you're checking through most turn cards after raising the flop. That's not the case. Or at least, that shouldn't be the case.

[Rico Suave]

Chief:

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You make it sound as if you're checking through most turn cards after raising the flop. That's not the case. Or at least, that shouldn't be the case.

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Many are saying that raising the turn will often buy you a free card if you want it, but I just don't see how taking a free card on a J,Q,T type turn card is correct. If it is checked to you, I think you must bet--the pot is too big to check and give 4 opponents a shot at you in the event you are best.

I think the better argument for a flop raise is that you can clean out the button, and the LAG may 3-bet with a worse hand to help you clear out the field. But I think putting in 3-bets on the flop is not the way to go, imo.

--Rico

[HolyBejeesus]

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Yeah, that's sort of the point of the flop call. You make it sound as if you're checking through most turn cards after raising the flop. That's not the case. Or at least, that shouldn't be the case.

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No. I'm saying I'd rather put in more money when I know I'm ahead than put in 2 big bets when I have no idea if an overcard hit one of my 4 opponents.

[chief444]

Yeah, I agree Rico. Certainly anyone arguing for a flop raise here better be doing so because they think there's value in it. And as I said, I don't disagree. I just believe in this case there's more value in waiting. Checking through the turn if checked to really sucks...as you're saying (just more politely). [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[chief444]

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No. I'm saying I'd rather put in more money when I know I'm ahead than put in 2 big bets when I have no idea if an overcard hit one of my 4 opponents.

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What do you think your equity is on this flop?

[HolyBejeesus]

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No. I'm saying I'd rather put in more money when I know I'm ahead than put in 2 big bets when I have no idea if an overcard hit one of my 4 opponents.

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What do you think your equity is on this flop?

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Off the top of my head, I'd say 30%, but that's just speculation. I would Pokerstove it but I am at work. Perhaps later.

[chief444]

Somewhere between 25%-30% sounds about right to me. Now, what do you think your equity is on the turn?