Fixing North Korea

[BadBoyBenny]

With the benefit of hindsight, what changes could have been made in American foreign policy over the last 60 years that would have led to an avoidance of the current situation with North Korea. Not just that there’s a dictator that has nuclear weapons, but the pitiful state of existence for the North Korean citizens.

What mistakes were made that could have been avoided?
Which administration made the biggest mistakes?
Could the war have been ended better? How and at what cost?
What could have been done during the cold war?
What about the last 15 years?

Who can come up with the best plan here, the sensitively nuanced liberals or the armchair admiral conservatives?

[BCPVP]

Possibly not threatening China and bringing them into the war. Then most of NK wouldn't (if at all) be communist.

[lehighguy]

We shouldn't have given into blackmail in 1993. Its clear that by the end of Clinton's term NK had started developing nuclear weapons anyway. We also shouldn't have given them any food. It didn't go to the NK people anyway. It was used by Kim's military to help him keep power. Perhaps if his own military was starving they would have rebelled.

North Korea is possibly the closest thing to hell on earth. Far worse then anything in the middle east.

[jcx]

The biggest mistakes were made by Truman. Gen MacArthur's masterstroke at Inchon had the communists reeling, when prior to that they had nearly secured control of S. Korea. China then entered the war and was actively fighting US troops. On the offensive and kicking the communists' asses, MacArthur wanted to take the war directly to China and could have likely broken their will to fight had he been allowed to do so. Truman instead fired him and would not allow US forces to bomb/attack anything in China itself, even though the US was directly engaged with Chinese troops in Korea. Safe in the knowledge the US would not bomb/attack any of its infrastructure or supply lines in China, the communists were able to beat back the US and the war carried on for 2 more bloody years.

I believe had the war been taken directly to China in the form of armed incursion into Manchuria coupled with B-52 bombings of China's major cities and industrial complexes, the Chinese would have tired of the war and withdrawn. Hell, even if they were simply faced with the threat of US invasion they may have backed down (Beijing is not that far as the crow flies from Korea). But Truman took that completely off the table, and they were emboldened.

Once the cold war got into full swing, I really don't see what could have been done differently. The N. Korean regime is as Xenophobic as they come and diplomacy with the Kims is all but impossible. Besides, the cold war is still very much alive along the DMZ. There is no peace agreement between the Koreas, and they are still technically at war.
Short of military action, which I would not support, there is little chance the communist regime will fall peacefully, a la E. Germany. This is because there are a few important differences between N. Korea and the countries of the Soviet Bloc:

1. The Kim regime could care less if a few million peasants starve. As long as the military is fed and the top brass are kept in luxury, the status quo will prevail. Enough hard currency is raised through weapons sales and drug smuggling (through diplomatic pouches, no less!) to take care of this need. Honecker, Ceausescu and the gang did
not have this luxury because of the reasons given in item
#2.

2. Kim Il Sung created perhaps the most successful cult of personality the world has ever known. He is literally a diety in N. Korea, despite being dead. Unless you are a member of the tiny elite, there is no access to the outside world whatsoever. Jamming devices prevent any S. Korean broadcasts from being heard in N. Korea. European communists never had the 100% control over information that exists in N. Korea, and they certainly never convinced the population they were demigods.

Sadly, I think the status quo will continue in Korea for a long time to come. Neither side desires armed conflict or it would have happened decades ago. The S. Koreans really don't want N. Korea to collapse, because the investment required to bring the standard of living of their countrymen up to 1/2 of theirs would bankrupt them. The real losers are some 20 million N. Koreans, victims of the biggest mindf*ck in the history of mankind.

[tolbiny]

"I believe had the war been taken directly to China in the form of armed incursion into Manchuria coupled with B-52 bombings of China's major cities and industrial complexes, the Chinese would have tired of the war and withdrawn"

This seems extrodinarily optimistic, especially with the potential for a huge cost with a war with china.

[Felix_Nietsche]

China launched a 'Pearl Harbor' surprise attack on the UN forces during the Korean War and I thought Truman's response was weak. Truman sought a draw while MacArthur wanted to "Re-Raise" the Chinese. Truman feared that uping the antes would drive the Chinese and Russians closer together. Perhaps there is some truth in this this but when someone launches a surprise attack without a declaration of war.....YOU NEED TO PUNISH THEM. If I were Truman I would have done the following:

1. Send Nationalist troops from Taiwan to capture the large Chinese island near its southern coast. Strategicly the island was of little importance but POLITICAL it would be a great bargaining chip and it would embarass the Communist leadership.
2. Blockade the Chinese Coast.
3. Fortify Hong Kong against a possible Chinese attack.
4. Possibly strategic bomb Communist Chinese production facilities. I say possibly but I would avoid this if possible. If the Chinese attacked Hong Kong then BOMBS AWAY.
5. Arm the Chinese Nationalist on Taiwan for possible land attacks. The Chinese would take notice and perhaps not try to up the antes knowing we could throw 300,000 Chinese Nationalists into the fray.
6. Drive the Chinese back to the Yalu.
7. Keep A-Bombs in reserve but do not use them. In the early 1950s the USA had a HUGE A-Bomb advantage over Russia. Just having these weapons would have kept Stalin on the sidelines without having to make any threats.

Granted the Chinese have a huge population but equiping and supplying an army is another matter. The Chinese Army during the Korean War was rather pathetic considering all the advantages the had in the beginning of the war. China has had an inferiority complex toward caucasion countries for the last 200 years and they made their BEST effort in the Korean War to defeat the UN forces and they failed. If Truman had grown a pair of balls and reinforced our armies in Korea we would have pushed them back into the Yalu. Many people don't know this but Stalin sent Russian pilots to fly Chinese fighters to attackAmerican forces. Truman knew this and kept quiet. I would have visited "Uncle Joe Stalin" and given him a Don Corleone like offer...


The next big opportunity to have slowed North Korea occurred during the Clinton Administration. Unfortunately Clinton, Jimmy Carter, and Albright chose bribary/appeasment. This failed...of course.

Then we have the ***holes the South Koreans. There president elected to pursue the "Sunshine" Policy. Where South Korea provide money and supplies to North Korea. If there is a North Korea A-Bomb, it was built with South Korean money......

What can we do now?
My position is the day that North Korea begins selling nuclear weapons is the day the USA needs to nuke them... Lots of countries will be shocked and angry at the USA but I really don't care what most countries think. Nukes can NOT fall into terrorist hands and everything else is of secondary importance...