Anyone checks through the turn here?

[mc1023]

The call preflop is a bit loose considering there's been a raise UTG and a caller, but nonetheless.

I can't see how you can not bet this flop, I don't think your getting checkraised here too often. EVEN if you did you it's such an easy call on the turn.

River you can always re-evaluate after, but I can't see myself folding on a blank river if UTG+2 called a checkraise from UTG and it was one bet to me on the river for a pot that big.

[AviD]

Hey steve, what is your intention in raising the flop? If you feel you have the best hand and are raising with that understanding, then it seems like a clear turn bet. If you are raising for a free look at the river considering your draw, then it seems like a clear check.

I don't think I'd ever check this if I raised the flop as I am raising the flop with what I am anticipating to be the best hand and the best draw.

I think the key here is UTG+2. You have him listed at 40/16, so he is pretty LAGGY preflop. How about postflop? You are only worried about one of them pairing up again and/or a non-heart A overcard, and if either of them are holding an A they are drawing pretty thin. So I agree you have little to risk by checking the turn, but you are also giving up a tremendous amount of value with possibly the best hand and a strong draw if you don't currently have the best hand. Then there is the possibility UTG+2 would call a singly turn bet but might not call a turn CR, which kills the value of your draw.

I like calling the flop here and raising this turn. Again, I'm not afraid of free cards other than for JT (but you have a J, decreasing the odds of it) and again it has to be a non-heart A or 9 to complete the OESD. Your only other concern here is AK, and I don't think AK is 3betting the turn with 1.6 aggression from UTG+1 so you can take your free showdown putting in the same number of bets and charging the draws that would otherwise fold the river unimproved. Even if you get raised on the turn, you have a strong redraw to the hearts.

[steveyz]

In this situation, I was mainly concerned with the speed with which the PFR called my flop raise. I definitely felt the turn check-raise coming, but I couldn't stop myself from betting (although I argued with myself for a while). The way I see it, the only hands I get an extra bet out of here (by betting the turn) is AQ, although QJ/KT are possible but much less likely for an decent EP raiser. He's likely folding the turn with JJ/TT/99/88, and he's check raising with AK/KQ/KK/QQ/88.

In the real hand, I bet, he check-raised, UTG+2 folded, I called and folded a 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] river.

[steveyz]

I think the preflop call is borderline. The factors that pushed me to a call was that UTG+1's PFR was 14 so although reasonable, he is the type that would open raise here with a pretty wide range, not just hands that have me dominated. Then there was the fish that cold called. I don't think it's a clear call by any means and I don't do it everytime.

[mmcd]

[ QUOTE ]
I think the preflop call is borderline. The factors that pushed me to a call was that UTG+1's PFR was 14 so although reasonable, he is the type that would open raise here with a pretty wide range, not just hands that have me dominated. Then there was the fish that cold called. I don't think it's a clear call by any means and I don't do it everytime.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think a preflop 3 bet might be worth some thought here. In this situation (an open raise from decent/perhaps a little on the LAG side player, followed by a coldcall from a total donk) I've been experimenting with 3 betting a little light in position. As long you think you are probably not dominated, I think 3-betting is better than calling here (but folding may still be best).

[mc1023]

good fold, although this is a stubborn fold for a lot of people to make seeing the size of the pot by the river.

[joeboss]

if you check the turn you should raise the river

[Paluka]

I think that the fact that you have to even consider checking this turn is why the preflop call stinks. If you can't push your hand and make value bets when you hit a board this hard, the hand isn't worth playing in this spot.

[ggbman]

[ QUOTE ]
I think that the fact that you have to even consider checking this turn is why the preflop call stinks. If you can't push your hand and make value bets when you hit a board this hard, the hand isn't worth playing in this spot.

[/ QUOTE ]

well put

[mikeyKay]

i cant think of a good reason to check the turn...looks like a super easy bet to me.

-mike