What? Me fold?

[Nate tha' Great]

My opponent has called before the flop alot, and is generally very passive, but I haven't seen him raise yet. I usually have more respect for a preflop raise coming from that sort of player.

Hero has A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] and is BB.

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop:
<font color="CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds, UTG calls.

Flop: (7.50 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(2 players) </font>

<font color="CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="CC3333">UTG 3-bets</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: (6.75 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(2 players) </font>
<font color="CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero folds.

[JustPlayingSmart]

I'm new to the forum, but I'll give this one a try. I like the fold. What card do you want on the river? If he has QQ, you have 6 outs, and 2 cards in which you lose at least 3 bets on the river. If he has KK you have 5 outs and 1 in which you lose 3 bets. If he has AA you have 2 outs and 4 in which you lose at least 2 bets (if he doesn't 3bet the river if a K comes). If he has JJ or TT, you have 0 outs. In none of these scenarios do you really have the pot odds needed to call the turn bet, so I think folding makes a lot of sense.

[Catch of the Day]

I'da played it the same way. Raise the flop for the free-card on the turn. Call the three bet, and fold without improvement. Seems like you read it well.

I mean there aren't many hands that you beat coming from this player UTG. At most, I would give you about 4 clean outs to the range of UTG raising hands he could have. If he has JJ your dead, QQ your dead, KK you got 7, AA 4, AK chop, AQ your ahead, AJ 4... I mean I think you played it well.

Catch-

[PuffsNutz]

Raising the flop for a free card isn't automatic here.
You 3 bet someone preflop that you havent seen raise
yet..Its too common a play in the 10/20 for a player
to lead into the raiser with a very strong hand.
(He knows your hand is strong, he knows he isnt
buying the pot here).

If you raised his BB and he called and bet into
you, a raise would be better vs this passive player.
But he raised UTG.

Call flop...Turn vs passive player Id fold.

[DrSavage]

[ QUOTE ]
Hero has A K and is BB.


[/ QUOTE ]

Hero is clearly not BB in this hand.

[stripsqueez]

your position when the flop is 3 bet hasnt changed much against many opponents to your posistion when UTG bet the flop - thats the argument for capping the flop which i think is a good line against lots of opponents most of the time - it works against lots of aggro opponents because they will get greedy and try for the check raise on the turn - it wont work against good players or at least not very often and it wont work against boring ABC players - the other issue with this plan is that you need to have a plan when you you miss the turn and river and UTG now bets

as you are an aggro player there is also history to be considered and whether UTG is capable of absorbing that history

i dont think its terribly logical to look at the options thinking he has AA KK or even AK as he would presumably be a chance to cap pre-flop with those hands - certainly it seems likely a bunch of outs disappeared on the turn

if this is the ABC player as i think your suggesting then i think you played it ok although for roughly the same reason its probably right to fold the turn it would of been right not to raise the flop

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[SossMan]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm new to the forum, but I'll give this one a try. I like the fold. What card do you want on the river? If he has QQ, you have 6 outs, and 2 cards in which you lose at least 3 bets on the river. If he has KK you have 5 outs and 1 in which you lose 3 bets. If he has AA you have 2 outs and 4 in which you lose at least 2 bets (if he doesn't 3bet the river if a K comes). If he has JJ or TT, you have 0 outs. In none of these scenarios do you really have the pot odds needed to call the turn bet, so I think folding makes a lot of sense.

[/ QUOTE ]

He has a gutshot to broadway w/ a queen on the river.

[Steve Giufre]

Why do you have UTG acting before you if you were in the BB? Did you checkrause the flop?

[Nate tha' Great]

I was MP in this hand, not the BB. The hand converter was acting weird and I tried to fill in some of the details by myself. That I did so incorrectly could be read as a metaphor for the perils of overdependence on technology, but we'll let that alone for now.

My opponent showed his cards after I folded. He had T6 sooted. The soot was neither spades or diamonds though it might have been suede. I typed something about having been pushed off of quad jacks in the chatbox. Weird play. I don't think I'd seen this guy raise at all the rest of the session. Maybe he was trying to capitalize on that. But I think he was just a fish and the bluff bell had gone off in his head.

I feel fine about the fold, though.