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#1
10-03-2005, 12:36 PM
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Manny Ramirez
Sorry in advance for starting another AL/Red Sox thread.
But, I think the Manny Ramirez situation is an interesting 'problem' for Boston. Bob Ryan touches on some of the major points in his column today. The guy is one of the best hitters of all time. His 144 RBI this year are only his 3rd highest total, and he had 9 home runs and 19 RBI's in the closing 12 games of the season, when his team needed him the most. He leads the Majors in assists, yet his defense is average at best. His base running can range anywhere from terrible to acceptable. he makes $20 million dollars. his teamates generally like him, even when he does crazy things, b/c they know he's just a lunatic. even the opposition doesn't seem to care when he admires a 360 foot home run for 10 seconds, b/c they also know he's a lunatic. the rumor is that his manager and the ownership group doesn't like him, but how much does this matter? so, if you're Theo Epstein, what do you do with him? live with his annual trade requests, $20M salary, pouting, and sometimes dogging it as an acceptable downside to his (spectacular) one dimensional play? or do the negatives outweigh the positives? 
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#3
10-03-2005, 12:42 PM
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Re: Manny Ramirez
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] yet his defense is average at best [/ QUOTE ] lol [/ QUOTE ] I didn't tell a joke. the guy makes some great plays; I remember him going into the stands to steal a HR in the ALCS last year; perhaps you do as well. he also makes some bad plays. he also led the league in assists this year. this is why he is average at best.
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#4
10-03-2005, 12:44 PM
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Re: Manny Ramirez
If you're Theo, youu put up with him because he's one of the best hitters ever in baseball. The positives outweight the negatives by far. If he was just a very good hitter then I would say "no's hes not worth that much and you shouldn't put up with his crap" but he's so much better than that.
Unless Theo could find an really awesome way to spend the 20m (highly unlikely) I don't think it makes sense to trade him.
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#7
10-03-2005, 12:48 PM
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Re: Manny Ramirez
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] yet his defense is average at best [/ QUOTE ] lol [/ QUOTE ] I didn't tell a joke. the guy makes some great plays; I remember him going into the stands to steal a HR in the ALCS last year; perhaps you do as well. he also makes some bad plays. he also led the league in assists this year. this is why he is average at best. [/ QUOTE ] A broken watch tells the right time twice a day. By your logic if a fielder ever makes an average or good play he is "average at best". That's BS. Manny leads the league in assists, and Ichiro has very few. It's pretty meaningless. The number of bases/errors people take off Manny far outweighs the assists.
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#8
10-03-2005, 12:49 PM
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Re: Manny Ramirez
If I'm the Red Sox GM, I only dump him if I don't have to pick up any of his salary. Then you have the full $20 million to replace him with other players.
Manny's extra value lies with Ortiz. Ortiz is so successful because Manny hits behind him. Lose Manny and everyone pitches around Ortiz.
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#9
10-03-2005, 12:49 PM
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Re: Manny Ramirez
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] he also led the league in assists this year. [/ QUOTE ] I would guess that this is because everybody runs on him. You're gonna throw some people out if you get twice as many chances as most guys. [/ QUOTE ] this is a factor, but I'm not really sure it matters. if you think I suck, and decide to test me, and I throw you out, does it really matter why you decided to run? you just made an out, and my team benefited from your mistake. also, I don't think he gets twice as many chances. it's not like people run on him at every opportunity. if this was true, you would see guys like Johnny Damon and Bernie Williams get huge assist numbers, as well.
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#10
10-03-2005, 12:50 PM
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Re: Manny Ramirez
Such a non-issue. His "annual trade requests" (what, two out of the last five seasons or something?) are nothing. He seems to retract them ten minutes after making them. I'm not even sure it's true, it's likely rumors started by the front office to help justify trying to trade their best player. Pouting? I've never seen him pout. I've never heard him pout. His "sometimes" dogging it? No one plays 100% all the time. One of the funniest things in the Bob "I'm a Moron" Ryan column: "When David Ortiz hit his tying homer in that same game, he was motoring out of that batter's box the instant the ball left his bat." Implying that David never admires a home run or fails to run out a grounder is ludicrous. NO ONE Cadillacs more around the bases after a home run than David Ortiz, who also fails to run out grounders at times, and doesn't play left field anywhere near as well as Manny Ramirez. BTW, I love David, almost as much as I love Manny.
The salary? Admittedly, he's a bit overpaid. Was a necessary evil to get him, as Cleveland was well willing to almost meet the contract he signed here. But really, for his #'s, you could expect to pay about 15 mil per year on the open market, and I feel the reliability of Manny playing so many games every year at a consistently high level year after year, despite his bad hammies, is worth the extra 5 mil; really, hardly anyone else in baseball works as hard as he does to be in shape and to be sharp. Even if it wasn't worth the extra five mil, you end up eating at least that in salary when you trade him, and you have to then replace him and it becomes a net loss. Those that think he's expendable because of Ortiz, thought the same of Pedro being expendable because of Schilling, and now our rotation sux. Not worth saving 5 mil, which you probably can't save anyway.
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