K-high on the river; A rare bluff from me

marand · #1 07-06-2005, 08:58 PM

Villian is too loose preflop, but not terrible after the flop.

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Hero raises, 1 fold, Button 3-bets, 2 folds, Hero calls.

Flop: (7.50 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets, Hero raises, Button 3-bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (6.75 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, Button checks.

River: (6.75 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets ...

I very very rarely bluff on the river, but decided to here.
I would have bet any blank card (thought he was very likely to be drawing to either a straight or a flush).
Is this standard?
If he folds, does that mean that I bluffed with the best hand?

Thoughts?

sy_or_bust · #2 07-06-2005, 09:31 PM

The flop play makes this a good try. A thinking player can put you on a pair here and sometimes lay down A-high. FWIW, this is a standard bluff for me against tight-ish opponents that make free card plays. It seems to succeed quite often, and certainly enough to be profitable.

Also, you will always fold KQ here, which is nice.

jrobb83 · #3 07-06-2005, 10:21 PM

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If he folds, does that mean that I bluffed with the best hand?

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Yes. He never folds an ace here and folds a pair even less.

kurosh · #4 07-06-2005, 10:30 PM

I think he folds an ace-high flush draw here.

jrobb83 · #5 07-06-2005, 10:45 PM

He 3-bet an UTG raise preflop, if he has an ace high flush it is likely with a high enough kicker to call a bet with.

Checking behind the turn like that tends to induce so many bluffs that people will call with weak holdings.

aflaba · #6 07-07-2005, 06:45 AM

I don't think that he folds any hands that are better than yours.

I think the possibility is very slim that he would fold an A.

If you had 89h then I'd like the bluff.

Surfbullet · #7 07-07-2005, 12:16 PM

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I don't think that he folds any hands that are better than yours.

I think the possibility is very slim that he would fold an A.

If you had 89h then I'd like the bluff.

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Does this mean that you'd check the river with our KQ-high, intending to call a bet and win at showdown? Or hoping for a check behind? I would tend to think we'll fold more better/chopping hands with a bet than we'll induce worse hands with a check, namely because I think there are few worse hands that he could have.

I think this is a good river bet, we certainly wont fold a pair, but since the only pair and flushdraw (Jacks, top pair) would not have checked the turn I think it is less likely that he has a pair. I think it's certainly possible that he'll fold an A-high flush draw as well.

Sometimes this is a cheap-showdown move by a bad player with something like 77 though.

Surf

dave44 · #8 07-07-2005, 01:11 PM

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I don't think that he folds any hands that are better than yours.

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If you had 89h then I'd like the bluff.

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Giving hero a worse hand adds very close to nothing to this bluff.

pyroponic · #9 07-07-2005, 03:31 PM

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If he folds, does that mean that I bluffed with the best hand?

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Yes. He never folds an ace here and folds a pair even less.

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I disagree, the fact that Hero check-raised the flop indicates that A high will be beaten most of the time here.
If no raises were put in on the flop, that'd be a different story.

aflaba · #10 07-07-2005, 05:52 PM

I disagree strongly.

The board is extremly drawy. I can easily see Button play a draw like he has played in this hand.

In fact, he "must" be on either a draw (or possibly a dumb A-high). Really the way he has played it, 3-betting the flop for a free card. With all that cooordination on the board. It screams draw.

Since he 3-bet before the flop he is likly to have high draws: AK, AQ, KQ. But he will also have a bunch of other cards alot of the time. At least that is my experience.

On the river he won't fold A-high. Maybe not KQ either.

Hero needs to check-call to induce bluffs from all the crazy hands villain would play sometimes.

If he had 89 he should bet, hoping that KQ all the crazy hands villain will play sometimes fold.

That is what I think at least.