I KNOW it's the Devil's Hand......

Given villian's raising range here, how about a pre-flop 3 bet? The limper may fold and if not that's okay, he's easy to read. True, you are out of position, but you may indeed have the best hand. If not, having represented a big hand you now take the lead and make the villian make tough decisions and as a result should read him better, particularly a brick and mortar player. I also like the meta-game aspects. Unwarranted chip spewing? Please elaborate.

[GreywolfNYC]

I think this hand gives me more trouble than any other, and it's got me thinking lately that even limping in behind someone with it in early position may not be such a hot idea. I will, however, defend in the BB with it 100% of the time (and I'm not sure that that's correct either).
I agree with those who said that you're either way ahead or way behind here and I dont think that trying to get tricky with it out of position makes much sense. I vote for calling it down.

[flawless_victory]

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fourbet the flop.
bet/fold the turn.
bet/fold the river.

if he goes five on the flop, call and fold turn UI.

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Huh?

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well my post was as clear/concise as they come, so what is it you are huh-ing?

[CardSharpCook]

your line is baffling. 4bet and bet/fold? So faced with the possibility of seeing the showdown for 2BBs, you would have us fold the turn after paying 1.5BBs? Are you really going to let him bluff you out for one more bet on the turn which a player like this guy is certainly capable of? Are you really going to put in another 2.5BBs and then fold to a desperation river bluff?

What is the purpose of 4betting here? Are we trying to shut him out of 3 outs on the river? Or do we want to tell him in even more precise terms, "yes, I have a king or better." Your clear/concise post requires some explanation. In fact, clear concise isn't what you should be going for. Help the OP (and the rest of us) follow your train of thought and understand why your baffling line is best. This isn't a quiz to see who can give the right answer the fastest, this is a place for discussion of what and WHY a play is best.

That's the "huh". Your line seems like bluff-killing spewing and you haven't provided an explanation as to why you might be right.

[flawless_victory]

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So faced with the possibility of seeing the showdown for 2BBs, you would have us fold the turn after paying 1.5BBs? Are you really going to let him bluff you out for one more bet on the turn which a player like this guy is certainly capable of?

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the playr description was brief, but from what i read the is NO FVCKING WAY he is capable of bluffing there... 99.9% of live 15/30 plyrs are not. if he raises the expensive sts. after u show aggresion, u are dead.


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What is the purpose of 4betting here?

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wins substantially more than calling down flop/turn and prob watching the river go checkcheck.
good for metagame....
in my regular live 30 (i dont play much recently because its not worth that much $wise), alot of the plyrs are scared of me... they actively avoid me cause im so aggro... that is a good thing.

[MNpoker]

Guess I'm the only one who bets this flop [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]