Theoretical situation.. first hand of the WSOP main event

[TaintedRogue]

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I apologize if such a thread has been created before, but here we go...

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And you got more responses than I have received on all of my serious questions combined.

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Imagine you are a pro, say someone as good as Phil Ivey.

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I can imagine that.

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It is the first hand of the WSOP main event.

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Then I wouldn't be at the table, as I always show up 5 minutes after Helmuth, but still don't get on T.V.


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You are in the BB. Everyone folds to the SB, who moves all in.

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The SB is on crack?

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You look down and find AA. Regardless of what you believe the SB to have... is this an instant call?

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Absolutely not!! You taunt the SB. You question him. You riddle him with smart remarks about stealing $50 in blinds with a 10K all-in. Only after you have looked at your hand several times do you tell the moron that you're going to call with your pocket rockets.

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Some people seem to argue that someone as good as Phil Ivey doesn't need to take such a quick risk, even tho he is a very likely favourite to any of the SB's range of hands.

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Those people are on crack.

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Some would argue that he could "out play" many other plays without having to risk all of his chips.

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Those people are on crack.

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Then again, winning this pot would put Phil in a great position to be very aggressive, and dominate the table, and perhaps the rest of the tournament.

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Duh.........do you think? Or do you want to smoke some more crack before making that your final decision?


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Some argue, if you're not willing to put everything in with AA in this situation, maybe you don't have what it takes to win the tournament, since you obviously need some luck to get there anyways. What better than to move your money in with the best hand possible preflop?

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Duh......

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Thoughts?

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You need to check into a rehab.

[whiskeytown]

Here's the problem....

We agree from David's book on Tournament Poker that it may be ok to pass up hands in which you have a slight advantage IF it's for all your chips and you know you'll be busted if you miss - go for the opportunies in which you'reless likely to risk ALL your chips, even if the edge is smaller.

Is Phil Ivey so good that he can not play a hand that will win 80% of them time? - Honestly, he could fold the first hand and still do fine, I'm sure.

But if we were to ask him (and we probably can next time he's on Full Tilt) I'd bet 20 bucks he'd call -

As Tom McEvoy said in his tourney book, he'd fold only if he thought the dealer was cheating - and EVEN THEN, he says that mostly in jest.

And if you busted the first hand - first one out of the 2007 WSOP, and you got all your money in preflop - I don't think there's a player in the world that would blame you - they'd bitch a bit, and be uptight, but in the end, they'd make the same call -

I would.

See you in two weeks when another variation of this AA first hand question comes up again... [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

RB

[kflop]

It is the first hand of the WSOP main event. You are in the BB. Everyone folds to the SB, who moves all in.

Anyone think this by itself has every happened? In all the years of the WSOP. Has the SB has never gone all in on the first hand after it was folded to them.

Then of coarse the BB could be Ivey, who wakes up with AA and wonders if he should call.

[TheMainEvent]

The new forum should have been called "Poker beats, brags, variance, and folding AA preflop to an all-in raise on the first hand of the WSOP"

[bluef0x]

I haven't read those books but I think the general reviews of them have been HORRIBLE. I would not read those.

It doesn't matter who you are- if you're afraid of playing the top 3 hands in hold 'em... you might as well quit right now. Ivey isn't 90% sure you have AA, he doesn't have mind-reading powers and can sense you won't play KK or QQ against him. Even 99% of the idiot poker players will play those cards against him.. along with KJo and other crap.

You are diving way too deep and thinking everyone in the poker world is going to think like you and KNOW what you're thinking.

Think about some sports, do you REALLY know when a team is going to run or pass? Even when they line up on the goaline with no WR's don't you see an occasional bootleg pass to a TE? There's no way you can be certain about anything.

[MrBlueNose]

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I apologize if such a thread has been created before, but here we go...

Imagine you are a pro, say someone as good as Phil Ivey. It is the first hand of the WSOP main event. You are in the BB. Everyone folds to the SB, who moves all in.

You look down and find AA. Regardless of what you believe the SB to have... is this an instant call?

Some people seem to argue that someone as good as Phil Ivey doesn't need to take such a quick risk, even tho he is a very likely favourite to any of the SB's range of hands. Some would argue that he could "out play" many other plays without having to risk all of his chips.

Then again, winning this pot would put Phil in a great position to be very aggressive, and dominate the table, and perhaps the rest of the tournament.

Some argue, if you're not willing to put everything in with AA in this situation, maybe you don't have what it takes to win the tournament, since you obviously need some luck to get there anyways. What better than to move your money in with the best hand possible preflop?

Thoughts?

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my thought is only a virgin would make this post LOL

[Piers]

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I apologize if such a thread has been created before, but here we go...

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I always feel nostalgic about this topic.

My first ever post on two plus two, about five years ago, was in answer to it, and despite the numerous times I have seen it since it’s still special.

It is also a very instructive topic, as it illustrates so clearly the huge misconceptions even apparently good players have about tournament poker.

[MCS]

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I haven't read those books but I think the general reviews of them have been HORRIBLE.

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You think wrong. The reviews are best characterized as "mixed," with a lean towards positive.

EDIT: This is for the hold'em book. The Omaha is largely regarded as bad.

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I apologize if such a thread has been created before, but here we go...

Imagine you are a pro, say someone as good as Phil Ivey. It is the first hand of the WSOP main event. You are in the BB. Everyone folds to the SB, who moves all in.

You look down and find AA. Regardless of what you believe the SB to have... is this an instant call?

Some people seem to argue that someone as good as Phil Ivey doesn't need to take such a quick risk, even tho he is a very likely favourite to any of the SB's range of hands. Some would argue that he could "out play" many other plays without having to risk all of his chips.

Then again, winning this pot would put Phil in a great position to be very aggressive, and dominate the table, and perhaps the rest of the tournament.

Some argue, if you're not willing to put everything in with AA in this situation, maybe you don't have what it takes to win the tournament, since you obviously need some luck to get there anyways. What better than to move your money in with the best hand possible preflop?

Thoughts?

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This has GOT to be a joke. I simply cannot bring myself to believe this is a serious question.

-Gross

[bluef0x]

I just did a search on here and found 10 posts stating it's trash with 1 being "It's ok for people who know absolutely nothing"

But nice try.