For AndyFox et.al.

[AmericanAirlines]

Hi AndyFox,
Here's an article I thought you might find interesting.

Capitalism Magazine
Racism in Congress: The Black Caucus
by Ron Pisaturo (December 23, 2002)
http://www.capmag.com/article.asp?ID=2286

Summary: Why do 38 Congressmen racially segregate themselves
into the “Black Caucus,” which shamelessly calls itself
“the premier power group in the U.S. House of Representatives”?
Because they are racist.

And a quick scan on google for "Black Caucus" found a much larger list than just those below. Still want to argue that the trend in racism isn't anti-white? If we recreated all the organizations with "White" in the title there'd be an outcry of "Nazism".

National Society of Black Engineers:
Black Caucus of the American Library Association
Official Home Page of the Congressional Black Caucus
California Legislative Black Caucus
The National Black Caucus of State Legislators :
California Librarians Black Caucus (CLBC)
Louisiana Legislative Black Caucus Home Page
Official Homepage of the Congressional Black Caucus of the 108th ...
Sponsored by the Black Caucus of NCTE and by NCTE
Michigan Legislative Black Caucus

[scalf]

[img]/forums/images/icons/smirk.gif[/img] but , aa, dontcha know blacks deserve reparations because of the evil of slavery, and they deserve special treatment, because they cannot make it on their own...it is the white man's burden....suck it up... [img]/forums/images/icons/crazy.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img]

[andyfox]

Groups that have been singled out for special mistreatment historically have organized themselves to watch out for their interests. If there were no anti-black racism in the United States, there would never have been a need for a Congressional Black Caucus. If women were treated fairly, there would never have been a need for the National Organization for Women. If Jews had been treated fairly there would never have been a need for the ADL.

White supremicist groups want to treat blacks like second class citizens. Groups like the Congressional Black Caucus want to assure that blacks are not treated like second class citizens.

Groups such as the Congressional Black Caucus are needed because of people like you, who don't want to live near blacks or eat in restaurants where they eat. And who don't want to have to let blacks live where they want to live or eat where they want to eat merely because they are black. And who don't want them to be on television, because they're being forced down your throat.

The reason that black groups are trying to instill pride in being black is because for so many years people like you have made them feel ashamed of being black.

Just to make sure I'm not wrong about what I think that you think: I am interpreting your past posts to indicate that you do not think the government should not allow you to disciminate against blacks (or any other racial or ethnic group). If you don't want to rent an apartment you own to blacks or Jews or Arabs simply because they are black or Jewish or Arab, or let them eat in a resstaurant you own, that should be your business. Correct?

[John Cole]

Andy,

See, you just have to form the groups without the tell-tale signs of race; then, of course, it's perfectly fine. Now we know the Daughters of the American Revolution really don't need "White" in front of their name. Oh, and their little gaff with "African" music? Well, that was a long time ago, and nobody remembers Marian Anderson these days. Do they?

John

[Michael Davis]

"nobody remembers Marian Anderson these days."

How could we forget the crack-smoking Washington mayor?

[img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[Cyrus]

Nobody would've thought of calling organisations such as NAACP racist a few decades ago. The fact that there's merit to this discussion now, implies that the black sector of American Society has made (or, more importantly, is perceived to have made) great strides in social advancement. Personally, I don't think that the phenomenon is indicative of racist resurgence in the U.S. because the public has been accustomed to more "advanced" social spectacles (e.g. Wesley Snipes French-kissing a White Girl), and not just in movies or sports.

So, while it was grudgingly acceptable some decades ago to give the lower strata some leeway or even an extra crutch to help 'em along, it is now to a lot of people bothersome, irrititating and even unjust to still be helping those folks out.

This IMHO is just an indication that the perception, at the very least (arguably, the reality is different), of Blacks in American society have changed. If anything, the perception has become more polarized : Blacks are either Michael Jordans, and why should multi-millionaire jocks be financially supported, or crack-dealing single-mother-makin' rappers, and why should anyone support them??

[Chris Alger]

What he says about the Middle East is quite a bit funnier. From the writer's letter to President Bush:

"Peace is the wrong goal... the current Arab regimes do not ... have a right to exist ... You should kill Arafat.... America ... should conquer the entire Arab Middle East, including Saudi Arabia, using our nuclear arsenal and our other military might. We must seize the oil properties that the Arab governments robbed....The entire region should be made a colony of the United States.
You should encourage brave and adventurous Americans (and others) to settle and develop this colony, as those in the 1800’s settled and developed the American West."
http://pages.prodigy.net/rpisaturo/President-Israel.htm

[andyfox]

I knew when Ayn Rand was cited what we were in for.

I think American Airlines is eLROY reincarnated.

[AmericanAirlines]

Hi Andy,
Well, seems to me, if you can find a rationalization for reverse discrimination, to you, that makes it OK. All you did was give a bunch of "becauses".

Fair is Fair. Either *no* race considerations or any and all. Any middle is just BS.

My Post means what it meant when we started all this in "Neocon". The tide of racism these days is going toward anti-white. The very presence of a race name in an organization name makes it race based, hence racist. There's no counter argument for that.

I do not wish to treat anyone as a second class citizen. And allowing other groups to band together, but not mine is treating *me* as the second class.

Yes, since "At will emploment" means I can be fired for "any reason or no reason", Why can't I decide who I will or will not do business with for the same "any or no reason". So in real effect all us worker types are second class. Union Workers and Gov't workers have protections the rest of us don't. So being a white unrepresented individual, I'm at the bottom of the list, protections-wise.

I can't "pull the race card" and run to EE0C. I have no Union Steward. My "contract", if you can call it that, states specifically that At-Will is not limited. Beyond that I can't work for my principle for xx months after all is done... yet I recieve no "valuable consideration" for giving up that right. Seems like a "no-contract contract" to me and I'd love to see those clauses tested in court.

Seems to me Thorogood Marshall liked to talk about "protected classes". Seems to me he was black.

As I've said all along. If race is *not* to be a consideration... strike *all* language to that effect. Blacks should not be a protected class in the same way ADA people are protected. If your "ADA and black" or "ADA and white" the protections should be the same.

If you are black or white, all other protections should be the same.

Since the Bakke decision stated that reverse discrimation does exist, yet refused to do anything truly constructive about it, we simply have a chicken sh*t decision.

I also believe we should not be passing bills like AGOA to support africa at the beheadst of the Black Caucus. This is BS. Because I don't even want african products in my home. But it gets hard to avoid when all the manufacturers start going for those cheap materials and labor and sending the jobs to Zimbabwe or whatever.

As I've stated before, I would defend any black's right to be equal in law, but also my right to exercise my right to not have anything to do with them, or everything to do with them as I see fit. And vice versa. They don't want me in thier businesses. Fine by me.

Where I draw the line as stated before is in public services. The gov't and possibly corps. funded by public exchanges should not have the same broad rights as a sole proprietor who has his own net worth on the line. Same for the apartment complex. Why should I have to suffer the very real effect on net worth that the blackening of the complex would bring? To meet *your* ideals? Perhaps when the AIDS and crime rate among blacks is less... then this won't happen? Then maybe I'd change my mind. So the onus is on them to join the mainstream... not to make thier ways our mainstream. If they don't want to fine too.

As for the media, I believe it is just *evidence* that whoever is running it is trying to push black culture mainstream. Not just for the money either. As I now see commercials where blacks are placed in the authority roles.

As noted before, if I have negative feelings about afro-culture, who are you or the gov't to push it on me?

As for black pride. They should be as proud as anyone else. There's no shame in being any particular race. But there are groups that a best separate from each other. Say Islam and Jews, for example.

However, none of this is a diatribe to return to separate but equal, which was legally enforced segregation.

I'm just saying I want the right to choose within the bounds of my life and my assets without interference.

And I don't want legitimized race based organizations like "The Black Caucus" telling me I can't.

Sincerely,
AA

P.S. Have no idea who Elroy was. From what I've read of Ayn Rand I think she's a little logically inconsistent too. She seems to argue for equality but thinks umbridled capitalism will lead to it. Highly unlikely. It hasn't worked to date.

Besides, truth is, despite the eloquence of the Gettysburg Address... the Civil War overturned The Declaration of Independance and made us all subjects of the Federal Gov't. Which is a Federal *Republic*. The upside, slavery was overturned. The downside, you can no longer stand in on place and say, "I am not subject to your laws".

[AmericanAirlines]

Hi Andy,
It dawned on me...

What you are doing is blaming non-blacks for wanting to stay away from a group with higher crime and AIDS rates, etc.

You are in essence blaming non-blacks for exercising thier better judgement.

This is illogical.

Sincerely,
AA