Another simple economics question:

[thatpfunk]

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He was arguing a different point than I was

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Oh, you mean the point of the the thread? You mean the OP's original question?

[vulturesrow]

Capitalism is not a belief system, as much as some people might try to make it. Christianity is a belief system, one that incidentally provides the moral underpinning to capitalism that makes it work. But to compare the two is invalid because they are fundamentally two different things.

[Exsubmariner]

Moral underpinning?

Agreeing not to cheat at poker does not make you a good poker player. It simply means you don't cheat.

Capitalism is more of a philosophy than a belief system. For the purposes of discussion, anyway, although some here would argue the symantics of that statement. Philosophies and belief systems are similar, but not one in the same and the philosophy of capitalism, the idea of making a profit to enrich yourself and possibly others, is not necessarily compatable with the belief system of Christians, where their religious icon was poor and believed in charity and giving... i.e. redistribution of wealth. In point of fact, Jesus took direct action against the capitalists of his day, the temple money changers, by overturning their scales and beating them violently with a cord whip. If that doesn't smack of Marx talking about hanging the last capitalist with the rope he sold you, I don't know what does.

X

[tylerdurden]

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Philosophies and belief systems are similar, but not one in the same and the philosophy of capitalism, the idea of making a profit to enrich yourself and possibly others, is not necessarily compatable with the belief system of Christians, where their religious icon was poor and believed in charity and giving... i.e. redistribution of wealth.

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OTOH, there's nothing stopping you from redistributing your personal wealth in a stateless system. You just can't force others to do it. People could voluntarily form all the communes they want. They won't have to pay taxes on their land, they can voluntarily donate their property to the collective. Anarcho-capitalism gives such communes the greatest freedom and the least outside interference.

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In point of fact, Jesus took direct action against the capitalists of his day, the temple money changers, by overturning their scales and beating them violently with a cord whip. If that doesn't smack of Marx talking about hanging the last capitalist with the rope he sold you, I don't know what does.

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This is a good point. I will have to discuss this with my barber.

[Exsubmariner]

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OTOH, there's nothing stopping you from redistributing your personal wealth in a stateless system. You just can't force others to do it. People could voluntarily form all the communes they want. They won't have to pay taxes on their land, they can voluntarily donate their property to the collective. Anarcho-capitalism gives such communes the greatest freedom and the least outside interference

[/ QUOTE ]

This would work out great until another collective has a crop fail and decides to steal from the one who had a successful crop. Since there was not a government in place to provide the protection needed, this should be easy. Then, all the collectives would see they needed to organize for common defense and then the whole thing would go hell.

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I will have to discuss this with my barber

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You are a lucky man. Good barbers are hard to find and that must be a really good one.

X

[vulturesrow]

I have to be brief but I will write more on this later. Regarding your poker analogy:

By agreeing not to cheat, we allow the game to play out as it should, the results being what one would expect give the interplay of luck plus your skill. When one cheats, he disrupts this balance and the outcome is not longer what is expected. Without some sort of moral (and regulatory framework) in which to work, capitalism would lead to unexpected outcome.

[ptmusic]

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He was arguing a different point than I was

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Oh, you mean the point of the the thread? You mean the OP's original question?

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NH.

pvn, please don't feel that every single thread requires a discussion about how bad things are with governments or how great things could be without them.

Instead, we can simply assume that's your take, and then continue on with the discussion at hand.

-ptmusic

[tylerdurden]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He was arguing a different point than I was

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh, you mean the point of the the thread? You mean the OP's original question?

[/ QUOTE ]

NH.

pvn, please don't feel that every single thread requires a discussion about how bad things are with governments or how great things could be without them.

Instead, we can simply assume that's your take, and then continue on with the discussion at hand.

-ptmusic

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The original question:

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Consider the following, from the Gospel of Luke :

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As he looked up, Jesus saw the rich putting their gifts into the temple treasury.

He also saw a poor widow put in two very small copper coins.

"I tell you the truth," he said, "this poor widow has put in more than all the others.

All these people gave their gifts out of their wealth; but she out of her poverty put in all she had to live on."

-- Luke 21:1-4


[/ QUOTE ]


Question :

Was Jesus right or wrong about this?


q/q

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Cyrus and I *AGREED* on what the answer to this question was, for those that weren't paying attention.

THEN, AFTER THAT, AS A SIDE-DISCUSSION, Cyrus started the other point.

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Politically, I believe the inherent contradiction between Christianity and Capitalism has already been noted on this forum -- and tossed aside, immediately.

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At which point we started arguing past each other because I read this slightly differently than he meant it.