Reads

[MrWookie47]

I've been seeing a lot stats being called reads lately. The notable exception is PokerBob. Get reads like he does.

I would bump Entity's thread on the subject, but he posted it in Micro. Instead, I'll quote it here, and provide a link to the original thread. Hell, I may go bump it in micro, too.

[ QUOTE ]
For a while now, I've been seeing posts for a while that say things like this:

Button is 22.5/8.7/.4.
CO is X/Y/Z.
SB is 1/2/3.

...and then the hand comes, and people ask how we should play if Button raises, and if CO coldcalls, and if SB checkraises. And everyone is happy. And the townspeople rejoice.

But I'm realizing something. I especially realized it today during a 4-tabling experiment. While clearing PokerNow's bonus today, I decided to honor the terms of their new T&C and not use any Playerview/GT+/PT software while playing. I 4-tabled $2/4, mostly 4 and 5-handed, and made a conscious effort to pay attention to everything that was going on around me. So I watched hands that I was involved in, and hands that I wasn't involved in, and I took a lot of notes. And I got a lot of stuff like this:

[ QUOTE ]
limped AJo, called down when bet into repeatedly w/no pair

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
limped A6s, called flop w/no pair no draw, checkraised when hit runner-runner trips. seems generally passive. calls with any pair to the river, has called river bets w/K-high (KTo) after flop action

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
limps with KK, QQ, etc. has limped then folded to a raise several times preflop

[/ QUOTE ]

Later, when I was reviewing my session, I realized how many more value bets I was making. Then I looked at the amount of flop/turn bluffs I was making. And the amount of folds that went from being confusing to easy.

And people were happy. And the townspeople rejoiced.

I'm just mentioning this because I'm starting to wonder how many of you are playing more tables that you can handle, or are developing some bad habits -- and it'd be best if you broke those habits now, while it's easy.

So I've got a challenge for you. However many tables you're playing -- cut out GT+/PV/PT for 5k hands. Go ahead and import the hands into PT, but don't export people's stats: export their plays. Do they bet gutshots? Do they check with TPNK, or do they play it aggressively? What kind of hands do they peel with on the flop? What sort of hands do they limp with? Do they give up easily when they limp preflop?

Stop treating your fellow poker players like numbers. Realizing that the 20/8/.5 guy limped with AJo in EP, then called down when the BB (me) bet out on a 62K flop, called when a 7 falled on the turn, and called when a 6 falled on the river (I had 76o).

The difference you'll see in your game will be significant. Give it a try. I know some of you take great notes already, but the rest of you would benefit greatly from paying attention to your surroundings.

Then, when you return to your PT/GT/HUD/XYZ world of realtime stats later on, you'll know that not only is your opponent an 18/7/2 guy, but that he folds ridiculously easy to flop checkraise/turn bet combos.

And people will be happy. And the townspeople will rejoice.

Rob

[/ QUOTE ]

[car ramrod]

that Entity post was one of my favorites. Numbers will only go so far. You should be able to get some type of a note on a player after just a couple orbits.

Play a session minus PA or PT, I see people say they do it a lot and it helps with note taking. I played 6 months without PT, dumb as it was, I learned to take goot notes.

Good bump (well sort of a bump)

[DCWildcat]

Very good post.

Readless PT stats posts don't make me happy, but posts against unknowns really annoy me. I don't know if it's a result of people multitabling when they shouldn't, playing sessions that are far too short, or just not paying attention, but if you have nothing on your opponent, you simply won't learn much from a post. It won't generalize vs. opponents you do have reads on. This is particularly relevant in short handed play.

There's no such thing as an opponent who is so unremarkable as to have no distinct reads or stats on him. So don't post like it! Sorry for the hijack.

Amen, brother. I use notes to make sense of stats. I make notes of any non-standard play I find, like check-raise bluffs and such. If you don't use PAHUD, you should always go to the hand history and see the mucked cards to make notes. Sometimes you'll be surprised to find that a TAG capped PF w/A4s or 87s, and you were way ahead the whole time with your TT.

But I only play 2-3 tables usually.

[Peter Harris]

into the digest this goes. I actually have just bought paHUD *but* I am having trouble using it at stars. Because of that, I am doing (actually, have always done) notes similar to NTTs. I prefer to know a player checks TPNK down to just seeing passivity stats, and I think the best combination of reading is about 20% stats and 80% observed plays, even higher in the latter case when sample sizes are pitifully insignificant (as many offerings are).

What trouble are you having with Stars? I use it there and have no problems. Did you make sure to pick between the image-enabled table or not in the layout manager?

[Peter Harris]

yeah, I am playing on enabled tables and HUD is set to that.

I get a thing where after a SD, the software lags and puts hands up permanently over avatars, leaves the board in place which obscures future flops, and when selecting "treat as 6max table" any stats i have on a player (which were in the wrong place of course) disappear.

I *might* be misusing it as i've only just registered it, and this is a definite possibility, but I'm gonna hold back for an update. Like NTT said, it gives me a chance to work on my note-reads.

[shadow29]

Hi DCWildcat,

You are a nerd.

Best regards,

John

[POKhER]

Try making PA pop up at 30 hands in, This way you should log 30 hands and have a note on atleast 50% of the table(thats 3guys!!! in 30hands).

Also have a rough idea of table as a whole and whose taggy/laggy/lappy etc.

On a side note, Try playing without PA for a week and see how you do.

[DCWildcat]

[ QUOTE ]
Hi DCWildcat,

You are a nerd.

Best regards,

John

[/ QUOTE ]

Mod, these kinds of shameless ad hominem strikes are what make this board seem so unwelcoming. I recommend that you ban him.

Best regards

ps- John, you're pledging my fraternity. Keep getting your kicks in while you still can. You've only got a week. Let me know if you want to get drunk on wednesday to celebrate exams.